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Author Topic: Oil in Airbox fix  (Read 2108 times)

PAndy

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Oil in Airbox fix
« on: May 26, 2011, 05:57:48 PM »
I notice people have been adjusting the oil level to "fix" the oil squirting into the airbox issue, has anyone tried modifying the crankcase breather system?

I was thinking of putting a small surge container directly on top of the crankcase breather to allow for oil to squirt out and instead of being pushed through the tube by the pressure, it could pool in the container and drain back into the engine.  I will probably put a small stainless perforated plate in the middle to keep the oil from just squirting directly through the container and possibly some stainless mesh or shot on top to provide a torturous path for the oil. 

If it works I think I will get a larger glass fuel filter and modify the innards so that it will look nicer.

Any thoughts?  I drew up a basic diagram in paint.

Ducati Scotty

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #1 on: May 26, 2011, 06:26:50 PM »
Many bikes have something similar already, my Ducati Monster had one.  Looking at your drawing I'd like to recommend a small change.  Instead of a screen or perforated barrier, just make something that diverts a direct blow of oil away from the exit tube and to the sides of the container instead.  Gasses will move though but no oil will get pushed directly to the exit point.  Also, offsetting the entry and exit points so they're not in a direct line might help too.

Nice idea, and probably easy to make yourself with some copper plate, pipe, and solder. :)

Scott

Fox

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2011, 06:36:40 PM »
Or you could... you know... put the proper amount of oil in it the first time   :P
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PAndy

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2011, 06:52:27 PM »
From everything I've read on here it seems that even if you do put the proper amount of oil in it can still occur under certain circumstances.

r80rt

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2011, 06:59:40 PM »
Fox is right, I've been putting in the proper amount since day one, never had oil in the air box.
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PAndy

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #5 on: May 26, 2011, 07:05:02 PM »
So where do you fill your oil to? I've been filling to the upper mark when engine is warm (waiting after 2-3 minutes running)

r80rt

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #6 on: May 26, 2011, 07:18:53 PM »
I fill to the bottom line, start and let it run for a few minutes, shut it off and let it set for 10 minutes or so, then fill to between the lines.
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Ducati Scotty

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #7 on: May 26, 2011, 07:42:38 PM »
Fox is right, I've been putting in the proper amount since day one, never had oil in the air box.

+1.  I do the same dance of underfill, run a little, then top up but I fill all the way up to the mid line on the window.  Never blown any oil out.

There have been reports here of some shop techs filling to the top of window and that causing the machine to spit oil.  I suspect this is because the older bikes spit oil no matter what.  They have a catch can to collect it or a duckbill that vents the excess oil to the drive chain.  I guess on those bikes you just expect to lose oil and to top it off on a regular basis.

Scott

drbvac

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2011, 08:10:04 PM »
Well I don't know about bikes but my Z06 corvette and a Porsche 996 both had oil catch cans for aerosol oil blowing back through the throttle body - some bikes have a bypass tube that just spits it on the pavement for the poor buggers running behind you.

Never had anything to do with over or under filling = but - as I said - maybe not the same cause and effect ???

It has to do with oil bypassing and they feed it back through the throttle body to burn in the engine but you are better off - at least in a car to get it the hell out of there - a catch can is neater or let the oil run out somewhere other than into your filter box.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2011, 08:26:34 PM by drbvac »
Dr B

olhogrider

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #9 on: May 27, 2011, 04:29:43 AM »
Pandy, yours is an excellent solution in search of a problem. The only time these bikes puke is when they are overfilled. You might say they are bulimic. Keeping the level visible about half way up the sight glass works. BTW, mine shows the same level at idle as it does 5 minutes after shutdown.

Sub

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2011, 01:35:34 AM »
This is a little off topic, but would it be ok to not connect it to the airbox, and just use a little crankcase air filter like this? Maybe you'd have to use a bit of tubing in between..


It would look cool! :)

r80rt

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #11 on: May 29, 2011, 01:42:18 AM »
Mine has one of those hidden discreetly behind the air box ;D
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GSS

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #12 on: May 29, 2011, 01:57:27 AM »
This is a little off topic, but would it be ok to not connect it to the airbox, and just use a little crankcase air filter like this? Maybe you'd have to use a bit of tubing in between.
Brilliant! Another thing I don't need but it would look cool 8)
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It's a Jeep thing......

gashousegorilla

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2011, 02:01:42 AM »
Mine has one of those hidden discreetly behind the air box ;D
My CB's Get the same treatment ;)
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r80rt

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #15 on: May 29, 2011, 12:26:46 PM »
Centerstand.
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GreenRE

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2011, 04:21:03 PM »
Does this KnN crankcase filter have a one-way valve.

Ducati Scotty

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #18 on: May 29, 2011, 06:58:26 PM »
No, it's just a filter.

Scott

Sub

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2011, 04:16:06 AM »
Does it need a one-way valve?

r80rt, ever have any oil seeping out of yours? I don't have this problem now, but I guess some others do (likely from over filling the oil).

Ducati Scotty

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #20 on: May 30, 2011, 04:57:15 AM »
A one way valve is nice but that's to keep partial vacuum in the crankcase which adds a bit of power.  It's  the same reason it's hooked to the airbox, partial vacuum (and it burns any vapors for emissions).  It's not required. 

Some filters weep on some bikes, some don't.  If yours does you can usually sort it by running a longer line and setting the filter higher.  That way if it burps a little oil up it doesn't make it to the top and just runs back down.

Scott

BRADEY

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #21 on: May 30, 2011, 05:52:20 AM »
Why not check the "Old English Arragement" on the Iron barrel REs...
It has a separate "canister, attached at one end to the engine and the other to the air filter box. Any oil that made to the top would be collected in the canister (oil catch can) and air would be released into the air filter box. It was virtually bullet proof.

Cheers.

r80rt

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2011, 12:03:27 PM »
Does it need a one-way valve?

r80rt, ever have any oil seeping out of yours? I don't have this problem now, but I guess some others do (likely from over filling the oil).
The C5 doesn't have a one way valve so I don't think it's needed. I used a long hose and went up as high as possible then I turned it back down a few inches to keep any water from going down the hose, no sign of any oil from it.
The UCE has a breather chamber bult into the engine right hand side cover, it's a hidden catch can that takes care of any normal oil and lets only vapor vent out. It's a pretty cool design, if oil gets to the air box it's because the bike is over filled.
Get yourself a factory service manual and parts manual, they will answer a lot of questions ;)
« Last Edit: May 31, 2011, 02:03:39 AM by r80rt »
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PAndy

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2011, 09:46:06 PM »
I've been very methodical about filling to the correct level, I'm about halfway between the two lines (approx. a quarter full on the entire sightglass) and I had the worse oil vomit to date last night. 

It only occurs when I'm at highway speed for a sustained period and it seems to be worse when the engine is colder but it is still causing quite a mess.

Does anyone else drive at highway speeds (~70 mph) for a significant period of time (20+ mins)?

Ducati Scotty

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2011, 10:08:54 PM »
I do, and no problems.  One thing to try, fill to just the bottom line.  Then get the engine nice and hot and see where it is.  You want it at the top line (middle of the site glass) when it's hot.  For whatever reason the oil is higher when the engine is hot than when it is cold.

Scott

PAndy

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #25 on: June 27, 2011, 10:18:28 PM »
That's how I fill it, to the bottom line, run for ~10 minutes, then fill to halfway between lines, so if anything I'm a little underfilled, but nevertheless oil vomit.


r80rt

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #26 on: June 27, 2011, 10:20:57 PM »
Have your dealer check it out.
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Kevin Mahoney

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #27 on: June 28, 2011, 02:39:59 AM »
reduce the oil level to the bottom of the line

Tri750

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #28 on: June 28, 2011, 03:56:42 AM »
low is good, good is low.
The owners manual says to mid-way it.
we tell new owners over and over to leave it where we set it
at PDI.
so far, just I of our folks overfilled and knew immediately
what happened. no drama.
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prof_stack

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #29 on: June 28, 2011, 04:24:45 AM »
If you measure what comes out, replace it with about the same.  My C5 level is at the upper line and so far there has been no oil in the box.  But perhaps after an aggressive ride it might be. 

Sounds like a challenge!   :D
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BRADEY

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #30 on: June 28, 2011, 08:48:02 AM »
The site glass on mine remains full, and I do ride it pretty hard as well.
But so far she ain't spit nothin.............!! ;D

PAndy

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #31 on: June 29, 2011, 11:38:25 PM »
@ Tri750

How high do you set it at PDI? Just add a preset amount?

Tri750

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Re: Oil in Airbox fix
« Reply #32 on: June 29, 2011, 11:49:04 PM »
On initial fill,  WITH FULL SYN OIL, just to where the oil is visible in the glass. After test ride and a 5 minute rest, it usually crawls up to between 1/4 and 1/2 up the glass.
During oil change, with soaking the filter and rocking, we bill out between 1.4 and 1.7qt,. of FULL SYN. OIL. Each bike takes a slightly different amount.
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