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Author Topic: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?  (Read 1701 times)

gunnerasch

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Im starting clean up and rebuild of a "'61 Indian" (Royal Enfield) and would like to put a stock gas tank back on it..getting rid of the peanut tank someone put on it many many years ago.  Will the very much cheaper asian Indian gas tanks fit? Or do I have to do much changeing and setup to get one to mount properly?

Thanks!

Gunner

ERC

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The Indian cheap tanks fror any Bullet classic model will bolt right on.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

gunnerasch

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Thanks!!

This is the scooter I have...

https://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/IndianRoyalEnfield

Gunner

ERC

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By the serial # the motor is a 1960 Chief.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

Adrian

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2011, 08:36:50 PM »
I'm using a fairly recent Electra-X tank on my '60 Redditch (Constellation) framed project. It does fit but on one small point you may have a little work to do. The Indian Bullet tanks fit an all welded frame. including the headstock. The headstock on a Redditch frame uses a casting which JUST fouls the underside of the pressed steel channel around which the tank is formed, right above the tank's front mounting holes!  You might have to elongate those holes vertically by 1/8" in order to raise the front end of the tank slightly, so that the front mounting bolt can pass through. I'll also be using a strip of old inner tube between frame and tank at this point to stop ant rattling between the two.

Have fun,

Adrian

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #5 on: August 17, 2011, 10:40:16 PM »
Here's one I just put together using different parts. Some from a Bullet or parts that will fit a Bullet.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2011, 10:02:28 AM »
Ooooh!  Very nice!!  Bravo!

I pulled my bike down this weekend and am starting the restoration..or clean up...or conversion...hummm..Im getting it ready for the road dang it!  I like! that red frame of yours!

Perhaps..Ill do the same. I was thinking of black...but...wow that looks good!

https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/RoyalEnfieldRestoration

Gunner

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #7 on: September 05, 2011, 10:32:19 PM »
Neat pictures at least most of the original motor and tranny stuff is there. You'll have a lot of fun putting it back into shape.   ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2011, 01:32:49 PM »
I did the frame in red..Chinese Red. <G>  Will have to put another couple coats on it as I scratched the swing arm..and the white (Rustoleum) prime showed through. Should I give it a shot of transparent as a final coat or simply deal with it if I scratch it again?

Since you seem to know what parts from a Bullet will fit...what will fit?

The forks are 8" center to center..so that leaves out an Indian speedo  housing.  Any suggestions on how to mount a speedo etc etc on this bike?  Any suggestions as to what and where I can get a headlight that will look proper on it?

Thanks!
Gunner

rotorwrench

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2011, 06:37:37 PM »
The whole front end off the India made bullets would work if it  is an earlier model. I'm not sure about the very latest stuff or whether it is interchangeable or not. They have been making changes to the original design over the past few years. You could also make your own speedo mount out of some aluminum sheet material. If you know someone who can weld aluminum, you could make a wraparound valance that would cover the lower side of the speedo so you wouldn't need a can to hide the bottom. Smooth out the welds and polish it up. That's basically all the Indian Chief had originally. It was just a cast aluminum cover and the speedo was held in with two springs and a rubber grommet around the dial face. You will have to get creative on this stuff. It's either that or take a trip to a local bike salvage yard and dig around for something that would work.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2011, 06:44:51 PM by rotorwrench »

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2011, 10:39:34 PM »
The forks on a Chief are 8" on center the bullet and trailblazer etc are 7' on center. I believe the forks on your bike are off a later Interceptor I have a set of those in the shed. They are 8" on center. Like Rotor said you'll have to find all original or just make up pieces to adapt.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2011, 01:28:57 PM »
Thanks guys. I may very well make up a "dash board" and mount all the stuff on it. I can weld aluminum (Tig and mig in my home shop) so thats indeed an idea. I heard that a friend of a friend has some "Royal Enfield Stuff", so maybe next week Ill head over that way and see what he has before making up a dash. Mounting it on the bike..if I have to make a dash..will be interesting. Were they orignally mounted on the front forks or attached to the frame and around the forks? Not a hell of a lot of space to mount to the handle bar mounts

Gunner

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2011, 06:45:24 PM »
Go on Hitchcocks and take a look in the Interceptor parts. sections it will roughly show how they mounted gauges etc.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

rotorwrench

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2011, 07:57:16 PM »
The Indian Chief dash attached in three locations. Each fork tube top had attach points and the third was at the steering head top clamp pivot threaded tube location with a special nut that also acted as the bearing for the steering damper knob & shaft. The handle bar attaches to the back of the top steering head clamp with a special chrome clamping arrangement. The handle bar was just behind the back of the dash cover with everything installed. If the fasteners are still in the tops of your fork tubes, at least you have two locations covered.

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2011, 01:05:57 AM »
The reason I said go look at the Interceptor sites is because the pictures that gunner put on of his bike, it appears to have a 69 interceptor fork top on it. So the easy way would be to attach any acessories the way it was done on them.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

Sandgroper

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #15 on: September 16, 2011, 05:22:58 PM »
ERC, the top yoke is not Interceptor. Those are Chief yokes, without the Chief dash panel. They are Chief forks, with a Chief front hub. The whole bike is a Chief, or if you like, was originally a Chief, even if it is not standard now.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2011, 05:30:24 PM by Sandgroper »

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #16 on: September 16, 2011, 06:56:37 PM »
Maybe I'm wrong but your top fork tree looks like the Interceptor. Here's a picture of the Chief top tree I'll have to look at mine tonight to see if the dash bolts on to the tree.
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

rotorwrench

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #17 on: September 16, 2011, 08:42:05 PM »
The Chief dash is a seperate piece from the top steering head clamp that just fits down on top of it. The dash housed the amp meter and light switch as well as the big Stewart Warner speedo. On the Trailblazers the top clamp housed the big speedometer only and was not a seperate part. The Apache used the first dual instrument top clamp that housed the Smiths chronometric speedo and tach. It was carried over into the USA versions of the Interceptor. All of the UK home market models used the large casquette that housed the headlamp and pilot lamps as well as the speedo, light switch, and amp meter so you won't find much information on Hitchcocks about the USA stuff. The late series II Interceptors used a Norton front end complete with gaiters and all that. The instrument mountings were also Norton with Smiths grey face magnetic instruments I believe.

If I was looking for a speedo/tach triple tree, I'd look for the USA Interceptor front end. The Chief front end does have that wide glide look to it and it's the only one of the models that used it with the exception of the Pashley type three wheel Indian Patrol Car. Those large bolt looking fasteners that go down into the fork tubes in the picture above, are the fasteners that hold the dash to the clamp top. The fork tubes threaded externally up into the clamp and those bolts thread down inside of the fork tubes.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2011, 09:47:38 PM by rotorwrench »

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #18 on: September 17, 2011, 12:45:29 AM »
I looked at my Chief and rotor is correct. I never looked that close at it before. The only ones I've had apart are the Bullet, Apache and Trailblazer ones. I would think it wouldn't be to hard to fabricate a dash to attach to what you have. Seeing as how it's not anything that holds the forks in place.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2011, 11:50:04 AM »
Thanks for that photo of the top section of the Indian.  Would it be possible to get a picture of that from both sides and directly from the front?  That would allow me to scale a new dash and then fab it up.  One assumes that the headlamp is simply a straight headlamp, with no gauges/switches etc etc?  And is it a side mount or how does it attach to everything? Im very short of photos I can work from.

Thanks!!

Gunner

rotorwrench

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #20 on: September 19, 2011, 06:23:44 PM »
It's a single post bottom mount. Check out this site and click on the Chief parts that Phil makes over in the land of Oz. www.re-indian.com.
He has a few items that he makes for the Chiefs to spare. One is the dash and the other is the phalic looking head lamp mount.

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2011, 11:18:24 PM »
Couldn't get to the other side. Heres the pictures I hope. I'd have to move it outside to get better pictures.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2011, 11:19:56 PM »
Here's the other
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

carlo

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2011, 04:58:24 PM »
Here's one I just put together using different parts. Some from a Bullet or parts that will fit a Bullet.  ERC

ERC, I'm doing a similar setup with my Tomahawk (sorry for going off topic), with the same front hub, forks and fender as yours. Did you buy the Indian made fender stays? I've ordered a pair of 19 inch front and rear alloy fenders from the NField Gear store, but held off on ordering the stays until I know that the hole spacing on the center stay  matches the fork for my bike. I have several Enfield forks, and the hole spacing is different for the 1958 Tomahawk.
Can you measure the center to center spacing for the fork holes on the middle fender stay for me?

Thanks.

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2011, 09:46:47 PM »
Hi Carlo, I made the stays for the front and back fender. They are just bent out of 3/4 " flat steel. Now that I look at them I wish I'd made them from stainless. I don't understand the measurement you want me to tell you on the stay. The stays go right over the fender in one piece. I did them that way, if you put indvidual stays on they don't support the fender enough. The measurement on the middle one from the fork screw to where it screws into the fender is about 9 1/2". If you want any close up pictures you can email me my email is on the page when you hit my name on this. I think you'd be ahead of the game making your own every set of stays I have didn't make it fit right.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2011, 08:06:07 AM »
Thanks for the photos!  Helped a lot!  I think I can weld up something out of aluminum that will work well enough.

Now..tough question....how the dickens do I polish up all the engine aluminum? I see pretty engines..but mine is dull gray at best.  Ive tried both Mothers and humm..the stuff in the blue topped jars...and it simply doesnt do a heck of a lot.  I even took some hidden parts and hit em with a soft polishing wheel with green grinding compound..and it simply wasnt doing a heck of a lot.  Whats the trick!??!!!!

Thanks guys!

Gunner

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2011, 12:21:55 PM »
No big trick just a lot of hand buffing,you just put a dab of polish on the rag and keep polishing till you get it to shine in a small area and expand it from there. If you can take them off the bike a buffing wheel on a grinder makes it go a lot faster.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

carlo

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2011, 01:50:50 PM »
The measurement I'm looking for is the one between the two lugs on the rear of the fork sliders that the middle stay attaches to. However, if you made the stays yourself, even if the measurement on your forks matches mine, it won't help me decide if the stays I'm looking at on the NField Gear site will work.
I've made stays out of flat steel before, and I'm hoping to improve on the makeshift appearance this time around.

Ok, on a closer look at your bike,  I see why you're confused about my question. I don't recall ever seeing a middle fender stay mounted the way yours is.
All the middle fender stays I've ever looked at were mounted just behind the fork slider, attached to the two lugs. The bottom lug has both the rear fender stay, and the bottom of the middle stay attached to it. 

I'll  have to check my forks and see if I have any with a mounting hole on the inside of the sliders like yours does. The angle that the stay crosses the fender is a bit more appropriate than when the stay is parallel to the fork.


Hi Carlo, I made the stays for the front and back fender. They are just bent out of 3/4 " flat steel. Now that I look at them I wish I'd made them from stainless. I don't understand the measurement you want me to tell you on the stay. The stays go right over the fender in one piece. I did them that way, if you put indvidual stays on they don't support the fender enough. The measurement on the middle one from the fork screw to where it screws into the fender is about 9 1/2". If you want any close up pictures you can email me my email is on the page when you hit my name on this. I think you'd be ahead of the game making your own every set of stays I have didn't make it fit right.  ERC
« Last Edit: October 02, 2011, 01:57:52 PM by carlo »

ERC

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2011, 03:01:41 PM »
Yea I know what you mean on where the fork stays mount. My Chief ,Bullet etc all mount like what your saying. The tubes on mine are different than what I've seen before. It could be they are off a late model Interceptor? The whole bike is made up out of pieces.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

rotorwrench

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2011, 04:39:59 PM »
Gunner, I use two products that work well on aluminum that can be used by hand. One is Autosol and the other is called Metall. Mothers is similar but I'm have no idea of the chemical differences they might have. If you start with a fine Scotchbrite pad or steel wool dipped in the polish, things will go faster for you. Then do a buffing up with soft cloths unless you have some form of power buffing equipment, this is the least expensive method to get results

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #30 on: October 03, 2011, 07:29:42 AM »
Thanks Rotor for the info. Ill have to try scotchbrites. I work in and around machine shops (I repair CNC and other metalworking machinery) and have some scotchbrites to be used on bench grinders. I was just worried about making everything uneven..but these castings are ROUGH as the pictures show...

https://picasaweb.google.com/104042282269066802602/IndianRoyalEnfield

Ive been puttering around with them for a bit every night or so..with little obvious improvement. Ive got a few big rag wheels and polishing compounds and ran the clutch case cover for 20 minutes..and never did get it to shiney metal. Just less pitted castings....Im not sure the result is worth the effort....shrug.

Gunner

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #31 on: October 03, 2011, 09:00:42 AM »
I just checked the guy in Oz who is selling the Chief dashboards.  $450 plus shipping for unfinished aluminum casting.  Blink blink....blink....shudder....

Im afraid Im going to have to pass on that gizmo.

Oh..another question..on top of the rear shock "mounts" there is a threaded boss on one..and a burned off clump on the other. Was this supposed to be used for a rear fender mount/rear seat mount?  My rear fender only is secured with a single hoop over the fender and a single bolt through the frame near the tranny.  One assumes that if I had need to put on a pillion seat for a lady..it needs to be mounted to something. Make my own or are original parts to do this available? Ive been  unable to find anything on Ebay to match up. Anyone got a good suggestion or bits and pieces kicking around?

I really..really...really wish there were complete photographs of these bikes so a guy could compare.


Thanks!

Gunner

rotorwrench

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #32 on: October 03, 2011, 05:11:19 PM »
Join the crowd on the good pictures. Indian Illustrations were warmed over RE illustrations and there are few good ones that answer all the questions that come up. Some of the RE twin frames had the stud bungs on the top of the suspension unit mounts and some just had a rubber plug that filled the hole depending on what type of seat arrangement was used. Keep in mind that nearly all of the RE twins used the same basic frame with small changes for the individual models. The Chief frame was different in the fact that it used the longest rear swing arm and it had the first central located mount for the top of the cylinder heads. All of the earlier ones used a side pull bracket to act as a steady for the lower mount plates. This new design on the Chief worked well and was carried over to the Interceptor models that came later. None of the seats used on the Chiefs utilized the threaded stud that I am aware of. Someone probably added them for some home brewed seat application.

I've seen all sorts of "custom" stuff added to these bikes. My first one was chopped, molded, and bobbed. It had an old early 50s RE front end on it so they could use extended tubes. It was a chopped out mess when I got it. I threw the frame in the junk pile and found another original one to make a decent bike out of it.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 10:42:35 PM by rotorwrench »

Arizoni

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #33 on: October 03, 2011, 10:28:08 PM »
gunnerasch

With castings that are that pitted and corroded you would be best to start with some 120 grit silicon carbide sandpaper, the "wet/dry" black colored stuff.

You can use this paper wet which will wash away a lot of the loose metal particles.  Doing this will help prevent the grit from "loading up" with the soft aluminum.

Don't be too quick to change to finer grit papers as any pits left will not be removed by the later sandings while using the finer grit papers.

After removing the pitting by several hours of sanding then start using finer grits like 220.  After the 220 switch to the 400 grit.

When the surface has a uniform look from the 400 grit paper, only then should you start thinking about polishing compounds.

Although they make 600-1600 grit wet/dry paper these are really intended for use on paint and you really don't gain much by using them on bare aluminum.
In other words, stopping at 400 grit and going directly to polishing is about the same amount of work as using 1200 grit paper which will still require polishing when you've finished using it.

I forgot to mention that if the surface is flat, use a small piece of wood to back up the paper.  If the surfaces are curved just use your hand to back up the paper.
Also, because the final finish will be polished, the direction of sanding should be changed every few strokes.  That way, the grit will be sanding off the grooves left by the last few strokes which will result in quicker metal removal. :)

If you have an electric drill that runs fast you can buy a spindle adapter that will hold a cloth buffing wheel.
These can speed up the process.
If you have access to a bench grinder with a 1/2" axle an even better approach is to buy a 8 inch cloth buffing wheel and mount it on one of the grinders spindles.

There are a number of buffing compounds that can be used with these 8 inch wheels.  You apply them to the wheel to "load it".

In the U.S. I've found  compounds and wheels made by Dico to work well.
The best compounds for polishing metal is "Stainless" and "Chrome".  The Stainless works the fastest and using it will turn your unsightly covers into mirrors.

These can be used with the hand drill buffing wheels but because of the lower speeds of the drill it will take longer than if you used the cloth wheel mounted on a bench grinder.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 10:42:06 PM by Arizoni »
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

gunnerasch

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Re: Will Indian Bullet Gas tank fit '61 Super Meteor/Constillation frame?
« Reply #34 on: October 30, 2011, 01:13:39 PM »
Many thanks Arizoni!

Ive been trying a few things..and have found that running a moderately course wire cup brush on a die grinder, then switching to a finer cup wheel seems to work quite well, Im not to mirror shine yet, but they look quite presentable as is. The chain cover on the port side has some dings and crunches in it and the one on the starboard side appears to have been welded at one time. This was only visible from the inside after removing the cover. Whoever welded it up did a very nice job! It was either a flawed casting repaired at the factory..or the past owner had one hellacious wreck..which might account for the hints that this was made from 2 or more bikes. Frame is very square and is unlikely to have held the engine that got dinged that hard.
I posted some other questions  in a new topic, if you would be so kind as to read it and help if you can. Much obliged!

Btw..I passed what I think was an Interceptor the other day on the road..had a cafe racer seat pan..single seat with a raised Lump on the backside of it..bright red best as I could tell. They are noticable when I see them..which is rare as hell here in California. I got a half second glimps of it going the other direction and I couldnt turn around fast enough and lost the guy in the back streets of Anaheim...shrug.

Thanks!

Gunner