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Author Topic: When does the new engines and New designs come out.  (Read 15367 times)

RagMan

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2007, 11:05:00 PM »
For those of us without laptops. . . .
aka Indiana Bulleteer.
''99 Classic Bullet. '05 Ural Tourist sidecar rig, converted to 2wd. '05 Harley Davidson Sportster.
Jefferson County, WA

prof_stack

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #16 on: August 01, 2007, 02:25:43 AM »
It almost seems like a non sequitur to put EFI on a Royal Enfield.  But that was also said about electronic ignition.  Oh, let's not forgot the electric starter.  EFI done right takes care of emission concerns and compensates for air and temperature conditions.  Bikes run smoothly with virtually no warm up time needed.  Its a win-win proposition.

Even Harleys have no carbs anymore.  Seems the worries about the RE's are about motor durability and reliability. 

Will the new engine have hydraulic valves that don't need adjusting?  I sure got spoiled with them on my Buell.  And all the other stuff as well.

BUT, would someone please post a pic of the proposed new engine and/or frame design?

justin_o_guy

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #17 on: August 01, 2007, 12:46:47 PM »
Well, I DO have a laptop( available)  & would consider adjusting FI setups IF I had even the slightest clue on what to connect to ,to gather data & then how to input to the Brain on the bike to get it to change. What software is needed?How can I learn to do this?

Didn't the old variable venturi carb address a lot of these problems?

I think I want a Classic 5 speed w/ electric start and an electra & when they come out, a fuel injected model. That way I could stop trying to figure which ONE I want.
With all these programmed changes, what will they Stop building? I wonder,, 

hutch

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2007, 02:15:52 PM »
It almost seems like a non sequitur to put EFI on a Royal Enfield.  But that was also said about electronic ignition.  Oh, let's not forgot the electric starter. 
The only way I would buy a Electra is if it can be converted back to points. I have had nothing but bad luck with electronic ignition on cars and bikes. Now that I know you can't put points on an Electra, I won't be buying one. One lost sale. I will stick with my Classic and 67 RE Interceptor. I changed every car and truck back to point distributor except the gas guzzling Sonoma I now own. I just finished up a Triumph chopper to sell and went with the Boyer electronic ignition, lasted 2 months. It now has a dependable Joe Hunt mag with points, no problem. Every bike I had with hydraulic lifters has been changed to solids for better performance. I won;t own a bike with EFI with the luck I have had. These so called improvements are just a way for you to take it back to the dealer and for people who don't want to get their hands dirty. I myself enjoy working on and tweeking my bike, that is called getting in tune with your machine. I like things I can fix on the side of the road, since any vehicle tends to NOT break in the garage. Kickstarts are sure nice when your battery is low. The relationship of a rider and a bike should be the same as a husband and wife. It takes just a little attention now and then to really keep things working. How long would a marriage last if you rode her hard and ignored her the rest of the time? I don't ride bikes, I love bikes, and that takes work.  The reason I bought a RE in the first place is because they hadn't messed them up with all this new garbage that breaks and leaves you stranded.  I guess the slogan 'Untainted by Technolgy" just went out the window.  That is sad to say the least.         Hutch
« Last Edit: August 01, 2007, 03:09:30 PM by hutch »
You learn from your mistakes, and I have LEARNED a lot.

deejay

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #19 on: August 01, 2007, 05:13:04 PM »
It almost seems like a non sequitur to put EFI on a Royal Enfield.  But that was also said about electronic ignition.  Oh, let's not forgot the electric starter. 
The only way I would buy a Electra is if it can be converted back to points. I have had nothing but bad luck with electronic ignition on cars and bikes. Now that I know you can't put points on an Electra, I won't be buying one. One lost sale. I will stick with my Classic and 67 RE Interceptor. I changed every car and truck back to point distributor except the gas guzzling Sonoma I now own. I just finished up a Triumph chopper to sell and went with the Boyer electronic ignition, lasted 2 months. It now has a dependable Joe Hunt mag with points, no problem. Every bike I had with hydraulic lifters has been changed to solids for better performance. I won;t own a bike with EFI with the luck I have had. These so called improvements are just a way for you to take it back to the dealer and for people who don't want to get their hands dirty. I myself enjoy working on and tweeking my bike, that is called getting in tune with your machine. I like things I can fix on the side of the road, since any vehicle tends to NOT break in the garage. Kickstarts are sure nice when your battery is low. The relationship of a rider and a bike should be the same as a husband and wife. It takes just a little attention now and then to really keep things working. How long would a marriage last if you rode her hard and ignored her the rest of the time? I don't ride bikes, I love bikes, and that takes work.  The reason I bought a RE in the first place is because they hadn't messed them up with all this new garbage that breaks and leaves you stranded.  I guess the slogan 'Untainted by Technolgy" just went out the window.  That is sad to say the least.         Hutch


Amen.

prof_stack

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2007, 06:22:46 PM »
Amen.

An understandable response to newer technologies.  And perhaps with the RE the "simpler" the better.  Makes sense.

But I wonder what Royal Enfield USA sees as their future buyer.  Emissions standards, noise restrictions, and quality control are obviously big areas of concern.  To me there are still too many question marks in RE quality for a new bike (Electra).  Heck, I'd be happy to have a RE thumper on par with my old '78 SR500.  I don't think RE is there yet.

luoma

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2007, 10:26:36 PM »
Robb, we have also heard proclaim that electronic ignition is harder to work on than points. What they fail to mention is that under most conditions, EI doesn't need to be worked on, ever. I think some old timers (and I am one), like the hands-on experience of fiddling with carbs.

RagMan

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #22 on: August 05, 2007, 12:35:43 AM »
I have had WAY more hassle with Electronic ignition, than I have with points.  I can change points, and troubleshoot the system pretty well, but have rarely had to.  Two electronic ignitions I have had, were not so kind.
aka Indiana Bulleteer.
''99 Classic Bullet. '05 Ural Tourist sidecar rig, converted to 2wd. '05 Harley Davidson Sportster.
Jefferson County, WA

deejay

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #23 on: August 05, 2007, 03:06:55 AM »
I think some old timers (and I am one), like the hands-on experience of fiddling with carbs.

Great, I just turned 30 a few months ago and already I am considered an old timer. :-[

Robb

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #24 on: August 05, 2007, 03:43:39 AM »
I have had WAY more hassle with Electronic ignition, than I have with points.  I can change points, and troubleshoot the system pretty well, but have rarely had to.  Two electronic ignitions I have had, were not so kind.

Interesting.  Were these ignition systems that you have installed yourself, or were they OEM parts on the vehicles you refer to, and what vehicles were they?  The last car I had with points ignition was a 1971 VW Beetle, and as far as bikes, I haven't seen points on a new bike other than an RE since the early 80's.  My current project bike, a 1975 CB750F SuperSport has points, but the Dyna ignition is on the bench awaiting the engine rebuild.

 

No way I'd leave points on any vehicle where the option existed to change to electronic, but to each his own, I guess.  BTW, I switched Diane's Military to electronic ignition earlier this year, and haven't had a single issue.  It starts without any hesitation, idles smoothly, and is a pure pleasure to operate since I sorted the carb out and got the valves adjusted correctly.

The simple fact is that EFI is the norm now and forever shall be, given ever tightening emissions regulations.  Luckily, CMW has plenty of carby stuff to bolt onto our RE's to keep everyone happy for years and years once the EFI bikes come out.

Now, don't get me wrong, I love our RE and fiddling with the carb is actually fun, trying to get the perfect setting and such.  Frustrating at times, but fun nonetheless.  Carburettors are a black art to me, where as the digital goodness of EFI and electronic ignitions make perfect sense.  I believe in facts and numbers, not guess work and emotion, so while I appreciate the 'basicness' of a carb, I really enjoy tweaking to the Nth degree with a number that can be quantified.  Pretty deep, huh? :o

scoTTy

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2007, 03:51:44 AM »
ok..  but i don't have a laptop.. :-\

Robb

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2007, 04:10:35 AM »
Sigh......  [pounds head against wall]

You won't need one.

hutch

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2007, 12:52:57 PM »
Sigh......  [pounds head against wall]

You won't need one.
But you will need a truck or trailer when it dies, in either case. been there, done that. My electronic ignition died 200 miles from home on Sunday. Shut the bike off, went to start later, nothing. If it would have been points I could have run a piece of emery cloth or even a dollar bill through them and got home. You can check points periodicly for pitting and change them, there is no warning with electronic. Give me a carb and screwdriver. If RE ever puts a belt final drive on I will shoot somebody. The way the RE is set up is like my Harley was. The belt would be captured behind the primary drive. Once again stranded. The HD softail I was riding is even worse. The belt is also captured by the rear swing arm and has to be removed also. Harley lists it as a 8 hour job to change a $159 belt. Glad I do my own work. I have also had 2 boyer electronic ignitions burn up on a Triumph. It now runs great with the Joe Hunt magneto with one set of points. I have bought more mags for my bikes over the years than I can count. Never ever had a problem. I'm spending $1200 to put one on my 120hp custom so I can eliminate the rest of the electronic garbage off of it. All the rest of the wiring is all ready gone. There will be 6 wires on the bike for charging battery and running lights. I like simple and fixable on the side of the road. Never been stranded with a bike I sat up that way. I have been stranded over belt drive and electronic ignition. They are not for me.           Hutch
You learn from your mistakes, and I have LEARNED a lot.

Thumper

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2007, 01:02:00 PM »
After rebuilding the engine on my 2000 650 Ural, I managed to bung up the electronic ignition upon reinstallation. So I swapped in points instead. Man, I'd forgotten what a pain they are! Especially Russian ones. I carried an entire spare CB points ignition with me at all times. Had to use it twice. Once with an aftermarket GM-based points failure (which were marketed as being of higher quality than the Russian ones.

Electronic ignition is here to stay. It's more reliable, more effective and requires no maintenance (inspection is optional).

There is virtually no market for points ignitions - and there is a reason for that.

Matt

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Re: When does the new engines and New designs come out.
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2007, 02:24:43 PM »
Hutch, it appears you are the poster boy for bad karma!   ;)

In 20 years with 2 Harleys I never had a problem with ignitions or belt drive.  The Electra-Glide belt had a rock imbedded in it and the dealer for years said not to worry about it.  I didn't. 

As for being stranded on the road, that's a pain but very rare.  Towing insurance is cheap.  Barring that, a pickup truck works nicely.  However, I do admire your do-it-yourself approach to the RE.