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Author Topic: Remove catch-can form an Electra  (Read 6567 times)

Bill Harris

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Remove catch-can form an Electra
« on: November 08, 2011, 06:00:37 PM »
Parts needed:
3/4"X1/2" clear vinyl tubing
1/2"X5/16" reducer.  I used a automotive PCV valve with a 1/2" inlet and a 5/16" outlet  and drilled out the check valve, I could not find a reducer the right size.
Duckbill form catch-can.
Plastic ties.

Attach Duckbill to reducer with a plastic tie.

Attach Duckbill and reducer to 3/4"X1/2" tubing with a plastic tie.

Route the tubing from the back of the frame to the crankcase breather on the oil tank and secure with ties as pictured in the first photo.

Route the timingcase breather tubing and secure with ties as pictured in the second photo.

      
« Last Edit: February 06, 2012, 12:27:53 AM by Bill Harris »

REpozer

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2011, 10:21:16 PM »
Great pics, Bill.

I haven't seen any "mayo" in my oil since doing this mod.
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boggy

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2011, 03:33:31 AM »
Nice... I'm always up for taking bits off the bike.  I'd like to try this.

Thanks Bill.  Back to the green tank, I see.
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tooseevee

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2011, 02:17:23 PM »
Parts needed:
3/4"X1/2" clear vinyl tubing
Fram FV 401 PCV valve or equivalent or a reducing elbow  1/2" to 3/8"
Flapper valve from the catch-can
Plastic ties

Route the timingcase breather tubing and secure with ties as pictured in the second photo.    

Hey Bill,
           What do you have on the open end of the timing case breather tube? Is one of those little round filter types OK? I have one of them on the crankcase breather of my "other bike", works fine.

            Although I've never had oil dump out of my intake box as others have, I still want to deal with this mess of tubing & black cans you can't get at on my '08 AVL over the Winter & "simple it up". I'm a firm believer in K.I.S.S.. I hope to "simple up" the intake at the same time. Then I can carry a sammich in the air filter case.
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Bill Harris

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2011, 08:20:40 PM »
tooseevee,

On the timingcase breather tubing, I just left it open.  If you are concerned, you could put a duckbill flapper valve on the open end.  Nfieldgear has them for $5.95, part number 140167.  It will be in the performance section.  If you route the breather tubing from the timingcase high and out of the weather, not low like I did, a little round filter would work just fine.  If you route the breather tubing down low like I did, I would not use a filter.  It will just get wet and clog-up if you ride in the rain or mud or wet streets or ford streams and such, I love the mud.  ;D      

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Royal Enfield people are good people.

Cheers,
Bill
« Last Edit: November 11, 2011, 10:15:22 PM by Bill Harris »

tooseevee

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2011, 01:35:58 AM »
tooseevee,

On the timingcase breather tubing, I just left it open.  If you are concerned, you could put a duckbill flapper valve on the open end.  Nfieldgear has them for $5.95, part number 140167.  It will be in the performance section.  If you route the breather tubing from the timingcase high and out of the weather, not low like I did, a little round filter would work just fine.  If you route the breather tubing down low like I did, I would not use a filter.  It will just get wet and clog-up if you ride in the rain or mud or wet streets or ford streams and such, I love the mud.  ;D      

Cheers,
Bill

            Perfect. Thanks, Bill. I love answers that actually just answer the question ;>)

             My next question will follow rapidly on the heels of this one.
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REpozer

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2011, 02:57:49 AM »
I put a rubber plug on the tumer vent, and another plug on the primary vent.
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Bill Harris

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2011, 01:26:00 AM »
Rode the bike today in the rain and mud for about 2hrs.  So far I think I like it.

Work in progress.

Cheers,
Bill    
« Last Edit: November 21, 2011, 07:40:47 PM by Bill Harris »

Bill Harris

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2011, 05:05:36 AM »
Removed Duckbill and reducer from the 3/4"X1/2" clear vinyl crankcase breather tubing and running the breather open.  It works just fine.  No noticeable loss of power and with less stuff to restrict breathing or go wrong.  Been running it this way for about two weeks now, in the rain and mud of course.  Oil looks good.  I'm very happy with it.  If I don't need it, why have it.  I'll keep you up to date with modifications as I do them.

Cheers,
Bill        
  
« Last Edit: December 18, 2011, 08:18:10 PM by Bill Harris »

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2011, 10:10:38 AM »
I never understood what the vents on the timing case and primary were for. I initially connected mine together with tube running across the top of the crank case.
When I changed to ATF in the primary I blocked the tube in the middle as a temporary measure. 8000 miles later and the tube is still there, bone dry inside, it doesn't look like any fluid has ever been in there.

Bill Harris

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2011, 06:09:39 PM »
Breathing is good!  Less pressure, less leaks.  Less pressure, more power.  One place I like pressure is in the combustion chamber, more power.  Let the engine breath.  ;)

Royal Enfield people are good people.

Cheers,
Bill  
« Last Edit: December 24, 2011, 01:03:41 AM by Bill Harris »

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2011, 06:20:48 PM »
I ran the G5 timing breather hose up over the rear frame, under the seat edge, and exit it at the rear of the seat just like an old Triumph. No duckbill, no filter, works fine. Also no blowby on the fender.
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cyrusb

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2012, 06:03:32 PM »
I believe the duckbill is there to restrict the air from entering your crankcase, but allowing pressure to vent. The only 4 stroke bikes I have ever owned that did not have some form of checkvalve were big twin Harley's. They had a rotary valve built into the oil pump drive. A whole lot of trouble, kinda think it may serve a pourpose.

Bill Harris

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2012, 04:16:07 AM »
I believe the duckbill is there to restrict the air from entering your crankcase, but allowing pressure to vent. The only 4 stroke bikes I have ever owned that did not have some form of checkvalve were big twin Harley's. They had a rotary valve built into the oil pump drive. A whole lot of trouble, kinda think it may serve a pourpose.

If I remember correctly, the old 250 Ducati Singles and the Royal Enfield 250 Crusaker ran a open crankcase breather off there oil tank.  

The breather duckbill isn't as critical on the AVL as it is on the old Iron Bullet.
Here's why.
With an unchecked breather hose, the air is pumped out of the hose when the piston descends, and pumps air back in the hose when the piston ascends.
This creates pumping losses which can slightly affect horsepower and heat generation.
Additionally, the Iron Bullet uses the low pressure zone in the crankcase to draw fumes down from the head, to assist the breather route.
A low pressure zone in the crankcase reduces pumping losses, helps rings seal better, and has less internal pressure to cause oil leaking out any gaskets or seals.
In the AVL or Iron Bullets with the oil tank breather, it is not as critical because that crankcase never really gets pumped-down to low pressure, so there never is a real low pressure zone in those bikes.
If it were an Iron Barrel model with the crankcase breather on the engine case, then I'd use the duckbilll because there would be an improvement.
With the AVL and later model Bullets with the oil tank breather, I don't think it will make much difference, so I removed it.

Cheers,
Bill
« Last Edit: January 18, 2012, 04:26:06 AM by Bill Harris »

cyrusb

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Re: Remove catch-can form an Electra
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2012, 08:05:32 PM »
Agreed on the pumping losses. I believe another reason would be to restrict the amount of  oxygen contaminatng  the hot oil. One of the reasons Positive Crankcase Vents are still very popular in car engine design. Don't know about the AVL vent system, but if it huffs and puffs I'd put a duckbill on it.