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Author Topic: Ace UCE project.  (Read 23690 times)

boggy

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #45 on: March 07, 2012, 02:22:43 PM »
Hmm - About the time I came aboard here. Must have missed it, BW.  I've seen some of the performance upgrades, like the 535 piston in the catalog, but haven't heard of anyone doing anything.

33bhp sounds GREAT!  Please let me know if you find those notes.
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singhg5

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #46 on: March 07, 2012, 09:19:18 PM »
@Ace.Cafe:

Are you going to do a dyno test on the G5 before and after your upgrade to see the change in its power, torque and possibly top speed ?
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Maturin

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #47 on: March 08, 2012, 12:49:02 PM »
The Cafe with the Seeley-ish frame is announced for late 2012 in the US. As it'll share the power plant with the Bullets there will be a factory tuning of some kind. So wouldn't it be smarter to wait some time to see if the improvements can be retrofit? Best regards
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ace.cafe

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #48 on: March 08, 2012, 01:09:14 PM »
The Cafe with the Seeley-ish frame is announced for late 2012 in the US. As it'll share the power plant with the Bullets there will be a factory tuning of some kind. So wouldn't it be smarter to wait some time to see if the improvements can be retrofit? Best regards

I don't know if there will be any special factory tuning on that bike.
I'm not counting on it.

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Ducati Scotty

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #49 on: March 08, 2012, 01:25:43 PM »
+1.  My suspicion is they have plans tp put the new twin they're developing into this bike at a later date but they don't have it ready yet, so it will just get a stock UCE 500 engine for now.

Scott

ace.cafe

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #50 on: March 08, 2012, 01:33:21 PM »
@Ace.Cafe:

Are you going to do a dyno test on the G5 before and after your upgrade to see the change in its power, torque and possibly top speed ?

Hi Singh,
Yes, we plan to do that.
And we will also flow test the head before doing anything, so we have benchmarks.
We will do all the necessary steps.

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Chiefharlock

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #51 on: March 08, 2012, 04:30:03 PM »
Hey ACE,

Why the V-Twin as opposed to a parallel twin?

Jason
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ace.cafe

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #52 on: March 08, 2012, 04:35:25 PM »
Hey ACE,

Why the V-Twin as opposed to a parallel twin?

Jason

A couple of reasons.
First, Aniket wanted a V-Twin, and he's the one making the crankcase. And people see to generally like V-Twins. Especially in the US.

Second, the V-Twin allows using the existing top ends to be used as a pair, so that no special barrels and heads for a siamese parallel twin need to be designed and manufactured.
Makes use of existing parts for much of the conversion.
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Bullet Whisperer

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #53 on: March 08, 2012, 07:12:22 PM »
For what it's worth, my money [and I could be wrong] would be on a parallell twin. Reason being, this [should] be a 'clean sheet' design and the big twins of yestert
year were parallell jobs. If they take this route, I would like to see a 180 degree 800 cc or so c traditional twin. The 'Iron Barrel' has gone, as far as the factory is concearned, despite them being a major part of my bread and butter. Time to move on, for what comes off the line, but the 'Classic' jobs will still provide lots of scope for the home tuner and stock machine riders alike.
  Harley and Ducati mass produce v twins for those who want them, already [among others], let's see what comes out of the factory doors next.
 B.W.

ace.cafe

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #54 on: March 08, 2012, 07:25:08 PM »
For what it's worth, my money [and I could be wrong] would be on a parallell twin. Reason being, this [should] be a 'clean sheet' design and the big twins of yestert
year were parallell jobs. If they take this route, I would like to see a 180 degree 800 cc or so c traditional twin. The 'Iron Barrel' has gone, as far as the factory is concearned, despite them being a major part of my bread and butter. Time to move on, for what comes off the line, but the 'Classic' jobs will still provide lots of scope for the home tuner and stock machine riders alike.
  Harley and Ducati mass produce v twins for those who want them, already [among others], let's see what comes out of the factory doors next.
 B.W.

Hi BW,
I expect the RE factory to make theirs a parallel twin. It would fit in their frame, and they have the production ability to cast and manufacture those parts.
I like a parallel twin just fine myself, too

For us here, we are using the Bullet top ends on the V-Twin crankcases that Aniket is making, because that is more within our ability to do. Less castings to make.
Here's a pic of the crankcase castings and timing covers, prior to finish machining
(From the Kneeslider article).



This is a 59-degree V-Twin, with a common-crankpin, enlarged main bearing size, wet sump with cast-in windage tray, both oil pumps providing oil feed, solid lifters with 2 sets of Bullet cams, UCE filter element, pushrods adjusted under the rocker covers.
Has the shifter tunnel to allow left-shifting 5 speed if desired, or right-shifting 4-speed or 5-speed.
These will be the crankcases used for the ACE V-Twin 1070cc "Double Fireball".

.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2012, 09:07:55 PM by ace.cafe »
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Bullet Whisperer

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #55 on: March 09, 2012, 07:53:12 AM »
That does look a neat set of cases, Ace. One thing occurs to me, looking at the blanks, has anyone considered that if they were machined differently [as required] that they could be a platform for doubling up other types of top ends, ie, a basic bottom end with crank could be offered with more than one pattern of stud holes, small end bush size, etc to accept perhaps a pair of BSA top ends, for example?
 Another top end that caught my eye as a 'maybe' for grafting onto a Bullet engine is the 850 [425] Moto Guzzi.
 Anniket might sell many more sets of cases, if they could be adapted for certain non R.E. top ens as well. Just a thought.
 B.W.

ace.cafe

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #56 on: March 09, 2012, 08:04:08 AM »
That does look a neat set of cases, Ace. One thing occurs to me, looking at the blanks, has anyone considered that if they were machined differently [as required] that they could be a platform for doubling up other types of top ends, ie, a basic bottom end with crank could be offered with more than one pattern of stud holes, small end bush size, etc to accept perhaps a pair of BSA top ends, for example?
 Another top end that caught my eye as a 'maybe' for grafting onto a Bullet engine is the 850 [425] Moto Guzzi.
 Anniket might sell many more sets of cases, if they could be adapted for certain non R.E. top ens as well. Just a thought.
 B.W.

Good eye, BW!
There is some extra "meat" around the area that mates with the jugs, so that different stud patterns and sizes can be accommodated, within certain limits.

It is conceivable that other top ends might be used on it. There are some hopes for such a thing.

Right now, these are the only two sets of cases which exist. But others will be made as we go along.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  and the Joe Mondello Signature cylinder head for the Bullet.

Please visit my new website:
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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #57 on: March 14, 2012, 07:03:08 PM »
Just a couple of thoughts:   I think the factory already announced that their twin was going to be parallel like a Meteor no?  Anikets project is his own thing for those who want a v twin .  (And their are V twins in Enfield history so why not)

Regarding the Cafe Racer to be released, I believe they are introducing it with a parallel cradle type steel frame as opposed to the single downtube of the Bullet.  Which led me to wonder.:  With no enclosing frame to surround it, how does the UCE engine , as a stressed member, contribute to lateral / axial flexing frame stability?  And would pumping more power through it, either with a "Juiced UCE" (sorry ACE , I had to get it in somewhere) or Anikets v twin lead to any concerns with the frames torsional stability?    I picture some sort of stiffening braces  going from the engine case sides up to the sides of the steering headstock (A frame)  as a stiffener to complete a "box"  around the engine right from the headstock to the rear swing arm attachment  and thus capitalize on the stressed member engines rigidity in two planes. .  From what I can see now, there are two points of attachement at the rear but only one at the from (single down tube) which must lead to the potential for some  twisting.    Frame technology seems to be a large part of design in performance machines.     Am I totally off base here?  (I often am)  Nigel 

GlennF

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #58 on: March 14, 2012, 07:06:06 PM »
Just a couple of thoughts:   I think the factory already announced that their twin was going to be parallel like a Meteor no?  Anikets project is his own thing for those who want a v twin .  (And their are V twins in Enfield history so why not)

Regarding the Cafe Racer to be released, I believe they are introducing it with a parallel cradle type steel frame as opposed to the single downtube of the Bullet.  Which led me to wonder.:  With no enclosing frame to surround it, how does the UCE engine , as a stressed member, contribute to lateral / axial flexing frame stability?  And would pumping more power through it, either with a "Juiced UCE" (sorry ACE , I had to get it in somewhere) or Anikets v twin lead to any concerns with the frames torsional stability?    I picture some sort of stiffening braces  going from the engine case sides up to the sides of the steering headstock (A frame)  as a stiffener to complete a "box"  around the engine right from the headstock to the rear swing arm attachment  and thus capitalize on the stressed member engines rigidity in two planes. .  From what I can see now, there are two points of attachement at the rear but only one at the from (single down tube) which must lead to the potential for some  twisting.    Frame technology seems to be a large part of design in performance machines.     Am I totally off base here?  (I often am)  Nigel  

The Carberrys use the standard Bullet frame ...

http://www.carberryenfield.com.au/OLDBIKE.pdf
« Last Edit: March 14, 2012, 07:09:13 PM by GlennF »

Ducati Scotty

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #59 on: March 14, 2012, 08:49:28 PM »
Ace, love the v twin!  Though I'm partial to the look of a parallel I really respect the idea of just building the bottom end and using existing stock parts for the top.  Will this fit in a standard UCE frame?

I hope the factory cafe gets a parallel twin at some point.

The single down tube, engine as stressed member frame with all the disparate parts bolted together is a noodle.  How could it not flex, even under just stock power?   That said, you can probably put lots of power through it without breaking it, it just may not handle as well as you'd like.

Scott