HPRE

Menu

Members Rides

2003 Military


in
Members Rides

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
April 20, 2014, 09:09:20 PM

Login with username, password and session length

 

Author Topic: Ace UCE project.  (Read 23503 times)

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 7397
  • Karma: 0
  • Ace Performance Bullets and Ace Fireball 535
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #255 on: November 27, 2012, 05:05:50 AM »
Had a telephonic chat with Chetan at RaceDynamics. He said that the locked version of the ECU(which does not work with the O2 sensor) will be available in some time. Currently the unlocked version is available. He also said that they need ECU pin configuration and other details to launch the ECU which works with O2 sensor and that they will launch one if they receive mass orders.

Also, they will need an O2 sensor, exhaust and wiring for to work on the export model ECU which will most probably have to be sourced from abroad as RE doesn't sell them in India.

Hi iron.head.
Thank you for contacting them and getting this info.
Amazingly, when I woke up this morning, I had an email from them in my mailbox.
This is probably due to your discussion with them, and I thank you again for that!

Anyway, we are going to pursue something with them and their programmable ECU for the UCE engine. And we have a bike with the export equipment on it here, and can provide them with any info, pictures, or even parts, that they might need to get us the unit we want. O2 sensor version, and also non-O2 sensor version.

I will respond to them today by opening the conversation of what we have planned here in the US for the higher power UCE bikes, and hopefully can begin to move in that direction with them.

This is good news!
Thanks!
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  and the Joe Mondello Signature cylinder head for the Bullet.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

iron.head

  • Neophyte
  • *
  • Posts: 33
  • Karma: 0
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #256 on: November 27, 2012, 06:19:24 AM »
Hi ace.cafe

Happy to be of help! Hope that we can get the UCE500 kit for our Indian bikes too given that we don't have the O2 sensor.

Cheers!

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 7397
  • Karma: 0
  • Ace Performance Bullets and Ace Fireball 535
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #257 on: November 27, 2012, 06:27:13 AM »
Hi ace.cafe

Happy to be of help! Hope that we can get the UCE500 kit for our Indian bikes too given that we don't have the O2 sensor.

Cheers!

My hope is to be able to do both types.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  and the Joe Mondello Signature cylinder head for the Bullet.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

gremlin

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1098
  • Karma: 0
  • "Do one thing each day that scares you"
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #258 on: November 27, 2012, 07:39:17 AM »
*IF* we are going to "roll our own" with an unlocked ECM.

I recommend moving to THE standard controller -->

http://www.microsquirt.info/

There is a whole community already built up around this system, from the days of B&G's Mega-squirt D-I-Y project.
1996 Trophy 1200
2011 RE B5
1979 XS11 w/vetter terraplane
1981 XS11 streetfighter
1983 Venture Royale
1982 CB750K
1971 Triumph Trident
1969 CB450
1966 Sears (puch) 250


ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 7397
  • Karma: 0
  • Ace Performance Bullets and Ace Fireball 535
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #259 on: November 27, 2012, 07:53:50 AM »
*IF* we are going to "roll our own" with an unlocked ECM.

I recommend moving to THE standard controller -->

http://www.microsquirt.info/

There is a whole community already built up around this system, from the days of B&G's Mega-squirt D-I-Y project.

It's interesting, but from my reading about it, it requires the removal of all the sensors off of the UCE engine, and using a new set of Microsquirt-compatible sensors. Not a trivial matter if the UCE is not using GM sensors. And I suspect it is not using GM sensors.
If I had to do it without any other alternative, that's one thing.
But if I can leave all the factory sensors and wiring intact, and swap in a new controller that will just plug right in and be programmable by PC, I'd prefer that.
And I suspect consumers would prefer that too.
Also, the Megasquirt controller is not any less expensive, and any sensor changes would add to the price too. And we'd have to program maps from scratch.

I'm not ruling the MS out, but I want to pursue this RD avenue to see if it's as feasible and low-cost as it appears to be.
My aims are for best overall performance with most reasonable cost and easiest installation.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 10:01:03 AM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  and the Joe Mondello Signature cylinder head for the Bullet.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

mattsz

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1810
  • Karma: 0
  • moto-gurdyist
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #260 on: November 27, 2012, 11:11:05 AM »
From the site:
"Why has RaceDynamics not come up with a performance boosting ECU for the Royal Enfield Classic 500 like a better top end speed and overall power gain?

First of all, the aim of the RaceDynamics stock replacement ECU is to increase the riding pleasure for the rider of the Classic 500 by eliminating the various glitches the stock ECU has been plagued with.

Secondly, many Royal Enfield Classic 500 have reported violent fishtailing of the motorcycle at speeds exceeding 100 Kph. So, in the interest of our customers’ own safety, we have not programmed the ECU for better top end speed and more power although such potential does exist with the Classic 500′s UCE engine."

Sounds like they haven't raised the redline and don't intend to.  Though they make one that will map to a free flow exhaust and is totally programmable with a laptop.

Scott

Really?  "Violent fishtailing" over 62 miles per hour?  I must be doing something wrong...

barenekd

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 4836
  • Karma: 0
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #261 on: November 27, 2012, 12:00:09 PM »
I showed 91 on my speedo the other day on a grooved interstate on my G5. Its slight weave started to intensify as I approached top speed and I had to grip the bars a bit to stop it. I as probably actually doing 82 or so, but it was a long way from "violent fishtailing."
However, the wheels must've thought they were doing 91. Smaller diameter Pirelli 90/90-19 tire.
Bare
2013 Moto Guzzi V7 Racer
2011 Black Classic G5 (RIP)
I refuse to tiptoe through life only to arrive safely at death
http://www.controllineplans.com

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 7397
  • Karma: 0
  • Ace Performance Bullets and Ace Fireball 535
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #262 on: November 27, 2012, 12:10:03 PM »
I seem to recall a year or two ago when this was a subject of much discussion here on this forum.
The C5 models were exhibiting this behavior, although it might be a matter of opinion about how "violent" it was.
Here's one thread about it.
http://www.enfieldmotorcycles.com/forum/index.php/topic,8325.0.html

We now see that the latest models are coming with the 19" front wheel and they have changed the fork sliders away from leading-axle to regular ones. I suspect that is a change which was precipitated by the stability observations in the early C5 models.

So, while it may be thought to be a matter of degree about this observed behavior, there does seem to be something behind it, specifically regarding the early C5 models.

It's also relevant to recognize that 60+mph is considered to be quite a blazing speed on Indian roads. It's very different than here.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 12:15:32 PM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  and the Joe Mondello Signature cylinder head for the Bullet.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

iron.head

  • Neophyte
  • *
  • Posts: 33
  • Karma: 0
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #263 on: November 27, 2012, 12:13:52 PM »
My 2012 C5(C5 special in the US) starts weaving right after reaching 115 km/h from the initial months of purchase. My bike has improved swing arm bushes/some bush mounting and new design front forks offset. The weaving intensifies to a very scary level when it reaches 125 km/h. Only once till date I was able to touch 125 km/h with no weaving at all, and that happened because the tyre pressure was low. Usually I maintain 22/32 psi. Lot of people have reported this figure of 115 km/h, right after which instability steps in. Maintaining low tyre pressure is a simple remedy, though replacing the nylon swing arm bushes with metallic ones might be the proper fix. G5/B5 is said to have a different frame/swing-arm design and I said to be free from this high speed instability issue.

Though some people have reported that replacing the stock hard compound tyres with expensive soft compound ones also cures this weaving issue.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 12:19:11 PM by iron.head »

Ducati Scotty

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 5613
  • Karma: 0
  • 2010 Teal C5
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #264 on: November 27, 2012, 12:30:59 PM »
Noooooo!!!!! Not another "wobbly C5" thread!  Noooooo!!!!!

Seriously though, take it to another thread.  I'd like to at least keep this one on topic.  And if you have a wobbly C5 send me a PM and I'll do all I can to get you sorted.

Scott :(

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 7397
  • Karma: 0
  • Ace Performance Bullets and Ace Fireball 535
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #265 on: November 27, 2012, 02:14:08 PM »
Don't worry.
They aren't limiting what we're going to do with it. That was just for the India Home Market bikes that don't have the O2 sensor, and the factory map wasn't well sorted and had problems with being too rich, and not running real well. They aimed to cure those problems for the home market UCE with a new ECU and new program.

What we will be doing is a whole other ball game. We will be raising the rev limiter and changing all the parameters via the programming interface, so it will do what we want it to do, in concert with our modified engine power kit
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 02:19:09 PM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  and the Joe Mondello Signature cylinder head for the Bullet.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

GlennF

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 885
  • Karma: 0
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #266 on: November 27, 2012, 04:06:35 PM »
The " Royal Enfield Classic 500"  is the Indian domestic market name for the C5.

Arizoni

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 3729
  • Karma: 0
  • "But it's a dry heat here in Arizona
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #267 on: November 27, 2012, 04:13:33 PM »
I can understand their initial logic in aiming their product at fixing the original Indian marketed ECU's which did have errors in it.

Royal Enfield has fixed that problem and will update  every RE sold in that country for free.  The owner only has to take his EFI RE into his dealer when a company engineer with the computer and attachment cable is there.

That said, it would seem there isn't a market for this new ECU unless the maker changes the goal to offering a way to increase power.

I understand the makers logic in not wanting to produce something that can harm people but he should face the fact that riding any motorcycle can be dangerous and it should be up to the rider, not the maker of aftermarket parts to determine where the limits are.

Belonging to a Indian web site that often discusses Royal Enfields as I do, I can vouch for the desire of many riders in that Country who wish for more power from their bikes.

Many are finding that simply changing the air filter and exhaust doesn't improve the bikes performance greatly and in some cases decreases it.
They are looking for other ways of gaining power and his product could give it to them if he only agrees to change his tactics and goal.

If he were to do this, his product would be a great success both in his Country and World wide.
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 7397
  • Karma: 0
  • Ace Performance Bullets and Ace Fireball 535
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #268 on: November 27, 2012, 04:28:57 PM »
I can understand their initial logic in aiming their product at fixing the original Indian marketed ECU's which did have errors in it.

Royal Enfield has fixed that problem and will update  every RE sold in that country for free.  The owner only has to take his EFI RE into his dealer when a company engineer with the computer and attachment cable is there.

That said, it would seem there isn't a market for this new ECU unless the maker changes the goal to offering a way to increase power.

I understand the makers logic in not wanting to produce something that can harm people but he should face the fact that riding any motorcycle can be dangerous and it should be up to the rider, not the maker of aftermarket parts to determine where the limits are.

Belonging to a Indian web site that often discusses Royal Enfields as I do, I can vouch for the desire of many riders in that Country who wish for more power from their bikes.

Many are finding that simply changing the air filter and exhaust doesn't improve the bikes performance greatly and in some cases decreases it.
They are looking for other ways of gaining power and his product could give it to them if he only agrees to change his tactics and goal.

If he were to do this, his product would be a great success both in his Country and World wide.

Exactly.
And that is what we plan to be making, using this ECU platform as a basis.
We have already opened the dialogue with them to work together with us on this project for Ace.

This ECU thing was the last key that needed to be turned.
We can do anything with the engine that we want to do.
It was this electronic black box that needed cracking.
Once we have that in our hands, with a programmable capacity, we can provide a variety of results for different levels of mods, from stock on up.
It will require a lot of dyno time for us to make up these programs, but it's all possible.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 04:37:13 PM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  and the Joe Mondello Signature cylinder head for the Bullet.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

gremlin

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1098
  • Karma: 0
  • "Do one thing each day that scares you"
Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #269 on: November 27, 2012, 05:27:14 PM »
Really?  "Violent fishtailing" over 62 miles per hour?  I must be doing something wrong...

+3
1996 Trophy 1200
2011 RE B5
1979 XS11 w/vetter terraplane
1981 XS11 streetfighter
1983 Venture Royale
1982 CB750K
1971 Triumph Trident
1969 CB450
1966 Sears (puch) 250