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Author Topic: Ace UCE project.  (Read 28028 times)

ScooterBob

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #390 on: August 29, 2013, 01:04:06 AM »
I don't doubt that replacing the existing UCE piston with a AVL piston will raise the compression ratio (assuming the cylinder is mounted at the same height) and result in some power increase.  This increased power does come with some risk though.
The revised combustion area with a flat topped piston may be more prone to pre-ignition or detonation  which the relieved dome piston helps to prevent.
Using higher octane fuel may be necessary to keep this from happening. 

BTW - I ran the dog-snot out of the Crash Test Dummy bike with the AVL piston it and the barrel cut down to 0.00 compression height (for proper quench ...) on 87 octane pump piss and had zero detonation, zero carbon build up and zero wear on any inspectable components. By "dog snot" I mean ON the rev limiter, WOT throttle for a 30 mile run, twice a week for a month. You can't hurt one .....
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mattsz

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #391 on: August 29, 2013, 01:25:47 AM »
Umm... what does "WOT" mean?  I've seen it used here a number of times, and I can't get it from the context...   :-[

Bulletman

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #392 on: August 29, 2013, 01:28:04 AM »
Umm... what does "WOT" mean?  I've seen it used here a number of times, and I can't get it from the context...   :-[
Mattsz..
Wide Open Throttle  = WOT
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Bulletman

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #393 on: August 29, 2013, 01:31:46 AM »
But it WILL maximise the amount of money left in your wallet - I just can't WAIT 'til the Gashouse Gorilla takes HIS stock, dished piston out and tries the AVL slug ....... !  ;)
Well....Scooterbob...all I want to really accomplish is to work on a simple project that has been proven.....AND save some money..hopefully a LOT of money from what I'm seeing..it also seems that I would save a considerable amount of time....which in this term is more valuable to me.... :)
"A Blast from my Past"
Mark F   (Northern, CA)
Black C5 2011

Bulletman

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #394 on: August 29, 2013, 01:36:22 AM »
   D'oh !!  Ahhhh..... Why not ?  I was gettin' bored just riding around on it anyway !  Guess I'm going back in....
Lets swap bikes GHG, feel free to work on mine....I believe it was a C5 that you have worked on before..I'm sure that's what it was? so since you have the experience working on that bike...I have a C5 too....I wouldn't mind a nice and sexy bike...smoothly running around town...I'm sure the girls would feel the same way too... ;D
"A Blast from my Past"
Mark F   (Northern, CA)
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gashousegorilla

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #395 on: August 29, 2013, 01:56:34 AM »
Lets swap bikes GHG, feel free to work on mine....I believe it was a C5 that you have worked on before..I'm sure that's what it was? so since you have the experience working on that bike...I have a C5 too....I wouldn't mind a nice and sexy bike...smoothly running around town...I'm sure the girls would feel the same way too... ;D


   Shush !!  Will ya !  The wife might be readin' this !  And sure ,you can barrow it......but the girls won't be able to catch ya. ;)  ;D   And you might be better off with Scooterbob working on yours. I go my own to do !  LOL !  ;)
An thaibhsí atá rattling ag an doras agus tá sé an diabhal sa chathaoir.

Bulletman

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #396 on: August 29, 2013, 01:58:37 AM »

   Shush !!  Will ya !  The wife might be readin' this !  And sure ,you can barrow it......but the girls won't be able to catch ya. ;)  ;D   And you might be better off with Scooterbob working on yours. I go my own to do !  LOL !  ;)
:D
Man o man...at least you gotta give me credit for trying.... ;D
"A Blast from my Past"
Mark F   (Northern, CA)
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ScooterBob

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #397 on: August 29, 2013, 11:11:31 AM »
Mattsz..
Wide Open Throttle  = WOT

Then there is "WFO" ..... Wide F Open .... with the throttle cable stretched and the grip clenched tightly in your fist .....  ;)
Spare the pig iron - spoil the part!

ScooterBob

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #398 on: August 29, 2013, 11:13:36 AM »
Well....Scooterbob...all I want to really accomplish is to work on a simple project that has been proven.....AND save some money..hopefully a LOT of money from what I'm seeing..it also seems that I would save a considerable amount of time....which in this term is more valuable to me.... :)

Well - There you go! That's the whole ScooterBob program ... Geeter DUNN and ride that sucker! Let someone else fettle endlessly ....  ;D
Spare the pig iron - spoil the part!

ace.cafe

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #399 on: August 29, 2013, 12:51:48 PM »
Well, we're still fettling, so anyone who doesn't want to wait could certainly avail himself of the Scooter Bob Program, or the Hitchcock's program, or whatever.

It has never bothered me any, if some people decide to use mods or parts from other makers, instead of ours.
People are free to do as they please.
We are just doing what we do, for those who want what we do.

« Last Edit: August 29, 2013, 01:12:17 PM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

ace.cafe

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #400 on: December 04, 2013, 01:13:24 AM »
Another little update.

Rocker progress report.
We are looking at three rocker options to present, and having them available for use with the head work.
The first will be just the stock rocker set as it comes from the factory. If the user just wants head work, and use the stock lift and the stock piston, or the flat top pistons for 535, then this will be the most basic option.
The second will be moderate ratio rockers of the stock style. Sort of like the Ace Shotgun Rockers which we will be releasing for the Iron Barrel engine. This will likely require our piston which will have some valve relief pockets in the crown to clear the valves when the piston goes over TDC. We may make a special 535 piston specifically for this, which will have the quench distance set to use with the stock(bored to 535) barrel, and the right compression and valve relief to use with this rocker set.
The third option is the Hi-Lift rocker set which we are already developing, and it is like our similar arrangement for the Ace GP Head for the Iron Barrel. It will feature new billet rocker boxes with shaft-type alloy roller rockers with a higher lift ratio. It will replace the rocker covers on the engine. This will lift the valves much higher, and definitely will require our piston with enough valve relief and compression increase to work with this system.
This will be a fairly expensive option for those who want extra power and are willing to spend what's necessary to get it. However, it is unique in the Bullet market, and Ace is the sole developer and supplier of roller rocker hi-ratio systems for the Royal Enfield. We will have it if you want it.We basically have decided to offer this roller rocker package across the entire Enfield model line-up from legacy to current models. It's a great upgrade in a much needed area of high lift.

The currently existing  UCE 535 pistons from others are flat tops without any valve relief, and they were made to use with stock valve lift, which is VERY minimal lift in the UCE. That's all fine and good for low lift builds, but we are going beyond that, and we'll have pistons for the applications all worked out.

While I don't have any pics right now of the UCE rocker package, I can show a representative photo of the similar package that we have put together for the Iron Barrel engine, on the Ace GP head. Those of you who have followed what we are doing with the iron Barrel engine may already have seen these pics, but I'm posting for those who might not have seen them.

Of course, the styling will be adjusted to suit the UCE head shape and style. I'm just showing the basic concept in this photo of the Iron Barrel system.
Please see attachment.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2013, 02:33:27 AM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

gremlin

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #401 on: December 04, 2013, 03:23:45 AM »
By wagging my thumb in the air and looking at the numbers it looks like your ported head with the stock valve lift would add about 15% worth of power.

I plugged those numbers into my calc, and, I only see a 10.3 percent flow increase. (with some significant flow jumps)  how do you recon it worth 15% ?
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Arizoni

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #402 on: December 04, 2013, 05:04:17 AM »
You really expect me to remember what I did 9 months ago?
I have problems wondering what I wanted to get when I walk into a room.  Sheeze!

OK.  The stock valve lift Ace mentioned is .300.
At .300 lift the stock head flowed 135.9 cubic feet/min.

@ .300 lift the modified head was flowing 156 cfm.  156-135.9 = 20.1 cfm increase.
20.1/135.9 = 0.148 which is equal to 14.8 percent increase.

At least that's the way my thumb figures it when I hold it up and wag it in the air. :)
Jim
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gremlin

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #403 on: December 04, 2013, 06:50:07 AM »
You really expect me to remember what I did 9 months ago?
I have problems wondering what I wanted to get when I walk into a room.  Sheeze!

OK.  The stock valve lift Ace mentioned is .300.
At .300 lift the stock head flowed 135.9 cubic feet/min.

@ .300 lift the modified head was flowing 156 cfm.  156-135.9 = 20.1 cfm increase.
20.1/135.9 = 0.148 which is equal to 14.8 percent increase.

At least that's the way my thumb figures it when I hold it up and wag it in the air. :)

Sorry, it was one of my less-than-sensitive postings .....

I coulda sworn ACE wrote the stock lift was .400 and he was testing to .500 for the extra lift .....   anyway, I added up all the flow measurements from .400 and below, then, compared the two .....

I admit; without knowing the cam profiles (time @ lift), it is still a guess - but my maths say the ported head only flowed 10.3% better.  A bit of low-lift flow was sacrificed for the numbers at the higher lift measurements.

Of course,  it'd be interesting to see just how much the dynamic cylinder flow would be able to keep up with the increase in ACE's static measurements.  a bit of calculus to be sure !   :o

redoing my calcs .....  using .300 max lift ...... I find the stock head flow total equals 564.77 whereas the polished head flows a total of 572.35.  a mere 1% increase with the stock rockers.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2013, 06:59:16 AM by gremlin »
1996 Trophy 1200
2011 RE B5
1979 XS11 w/vetter terraplane
1981 XS11 streetfighter
1983 Venture Royale
1982 CB750K
1971 Triumph Trident
1969 CB450
1966 Sears (puch) 250


ScooterBob

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Re: Ace UCE project.
« Reply #404 on: December 04, 2013, 11:26:02 AM »
Sorry, it was one of my less-than-sensitive postings .....

I coulda sworn ACE wrote the stock lift was .400 and he was testing to .500 for the extra lift .....   anyway, I added up all the flow measurements from .400 and below, then, compared the two .....

I admit; without knowing the cam profiles (time @ lift), it is still a guess - but my maths say the ported head only flowed 10.3% better.  A bit of low-lift flow was sacrificed for the numbers at the higher lift measurements.

Of course,  it'd be interesting to see just how much the dynamic cylinder flow would be able to keep up with the increase in ACE's static measurements.  a bit of calculus to be sure !   :o

redoing my calcs .....  using .300 max lift ...... I find the stock head flow total equals 564.77 whereas the polished head flows a total of 572.35.  a mere 1% increase with the stock rockers.

You can get more lift than that from "stock" cams ..... Right, GHG?  ;)
Spare the pig iron - spoil the part!