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Author Topic: Gray smoke spit from carbs  (Read 2939 times)

ace.cafe

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #30 on: October 02, 2012, 02:56:10 PM »
Double check your pushrod adjustments, to be sure that they are not too tight.
Adjust them when the engine is cold, and have no perceptible up/down play, but NEVER too tight. They should easily spin with finger spinning when cold.

The mechanics in India are notorious for setting pushrod adjustment too tight, in an effort to make the bike quieter. This is VERY bad and should NEVER be done.

Too-tight adjustment of the pushrods can cause this kind of spitting back, in some cases. I'm not saying it IS causing it in your engine, but it should be checked, especially if any Indian mechanic had his hands on it.
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AgentX

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #31 on: October 02, 2012, 03:48:13 PM »
Hm, I adjusted them about 200 miles ago myself but will check tomorrow morning. Engine's still pretty new so maybe stuff's still wearing in quickly.

Arizoni

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #32 on: October 02, 2012, 09:40:54 PM »
You didn't frinkle with the cam timing did you?

If the intake is opening too soon that could cause some spitting from the carb.
Jim
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ace.cafe

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #33 on: October 02, 2012, 10:04:37 PM »
You didn't frinkle with the cam timing did you?

If the intake is opening too soon that could cause some spitting from the carb.

Even the stock Bullets open the intake too soon.  But if you buy a used Bullet that has been around the block in India, there's no telling what's been done to it.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

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AgentX

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #34 on: October 03, 2012, 03:16:30 AM »
Pushrods were perfect.

Engine was assembled here in India by one of those "mechanics," but when I spoke to him about the engine we even discussed how the timing marks were supposed to be oriented.  Haven't opened the timing cover myself to check it out, but since there's no other performance-based additions to the engine I would doubt that's the problem.

I retarded the timing a hair.  I am still, it seems, unable to clearly differentiate ping from the normal valve noise.  Someone else described it as something like the sound of a ball-point pen clicking rapidly, but I'm also thinking that's what my valves sound like at high RPM. 

What I suspected was ping sounded like a small rattlesnake somewhere on my rockerbox.  Not clearly audible unless you were paying particular attention to the engine sound, and although it seemed to stop when you let off throttle, it was very rhythmic.  Is this just the sound of my valves?


jartist

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #35 on: October 03, 2012, 05:51:36 AM »
I've had my uce ping briefly a couple times in very specific circumstances and it sounded just like the ping of a small japanese four banger.

AgentX

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #36 on: October 03, 2012, 06:17:32 AM »
I've had my uce ping briefly a couple times in very specific circumstances and it sounded just like the ping of a small japanese four banger.

Thanks--alas I have no frame of reference for that.

ace.cafe

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #37 on: October 03, 2012, 12:42:55 PM »
Pushrods were perfect.

Engine was assembled here in India by one of those "mechanics," but when I spoke to him about the engine we even discussed how the timing marks were supposed to be oriented.  Haven't opened the timing cover myself to check it out, but since there's no other performance-based additions to the engine I would doubt that's the problem.

I retarded the timing a hair.  I am still, it seems, unable to clearly differentiate ping from the normal valve noise.  Someone else described it as something like the sound of a ball-point pen clicking rapidly, but I'm also thinking that's what my valves sound like at high RPM. 

What I suspected was ping sounded like a small rattlesnake somewhere on my rockerbox.  Not clearly audible unless you were paying particular attention to the engine sound, and although it seemed to stop when you let off throttle, it was very rhythmic.  Is this just the sound of my valves?

Regarding the ping noise, you can differentiate it by when it happens.
The valve/tappet noise is always there.
The ping noise is only there under loads with the throttle open further than normal, such as on hills at rpms below 3500, or exceptionally hard acceleration, or lugging the engine.

The ping will go away if you back off the throttle when you are hearing it.
The valve noise will not go away.
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AgentX

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #38 on: October 03, 2012, 03:33:02 PM »
Thanks, Tom-

The disappearance when I've backed off throttle is what's made me consider it ping; I just started to think maybe it was just how the valves sounded at a certain RPM.  It's kind of hard to separate all the sounds.

What I could use is a relative idea of how loud the noise is...the sound I hear you really need to listen for, whereas when someone says "ping" I imagine a noise that would make me say "What the HELL was that??"

ace.cafe

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #39 on: October 03, 2012, 04:04:10 PM »
Ping does not have any harmonious timing with the engine noises.
The ping is just randomly occurring metallic clicking noises that do not coincide at all with any engine noises or rpm speed.
It's like as if your keys were rattling and jiggling against the handlebars or something, only under hard load conditions. That kind of noise.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

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baird4444

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #40 on: October 03, 2012, 08:38:30 PM »
Ping sounds like to me if you dropped a piece of peagravel into an old galvanized
bucket.....
did you check your point gap yet?
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AgentX

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #41 on: October 04, 2012, 01:28:46 AM »
The gap is good


Yup, thanks.

I feel silly asking, but can anyone comment on the volume of pinging, rather than how it sounds?  Is it clearly audible as you're riding along, or do you generally need to be paying attention to hear it?

LarsBloodbeard

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #42 on: December 03, 2012, 03:30:59 AM »
It may not be real loud with all the wind/road noise and your helmet on, but it should be noticeable.

Here's a couple examples I found on youtube.  Not the best quality, but if you listen close you can hear it.
http://youtu.be/JA0cH_vRABg
http://youtu.be/VLwM_0k1LRg

Arizoni

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Re: Gray smoke spit from carbs
« Reply #43 on: December 03, 2012, 03:38:18 AM »
I kinda like some pea gravel in a coffee can rattle analogy but with a single cylinder it's more like one pea gravel in the can and it often happens at about the same frequency as the thumps of the exhaust.
Jim
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