luggage rack fitting for a 2011 B5

[mattsz]

So I ordered two racks from NField Gear - one that's meant, in theory, to fit my bike (Z90205 "Carrier, Rear Versatile w/ Pillion Seat [Bullet]"), and one that isn't (Z91110 "Carrier, Rear Luggage [Electra and G5]").  Neither fits.

The Bullet rack first.  The bolt holes all line up, but the front arms that mount to the shock bolts are too close together.  They fall well inside the fender supports, and in fact almost touch the fender.  In order to mount them to the shock bolts, each arm would have to be bent out approximately one inch, outside the fender supports and then straight down again.  I'm afraid that if I bend the arms the needed amount, I'll damage the finish (which is crap anyway), or worse, break the arm.

Photo 1: Wide view of the rack - it's mount holes are lined up the way they would be for proper installation, but the front arms land inside the fender supports, nowhere near the shock mount bolts.

Photo 2: Closeup of the front arm - not even close.

Photo 3: Similar to 2, but from above - shows how far apart the arm and its mount are.

G5 rack to follow...

[mattsz]

The G5 rack: I like the look much better.  But, it doesn't fit, as expected.  GlennF's rack was close, or at least it looks that way; his dealer installed it and I don't know what kind of conniptions they went through.  I can picture in my head some bracket concepts, but does anyone have any ideas?  How much can I bend the arms before the chrome finish is damaged?

Photo 1: general view - the back holes almost line up, but it needs to be elevated so it doesn't hit the B5 fender hump.

Photo 2: side view - things don't look too bad from this angle...

Photo 3: top view - this rack is much wider at the front; the arms land about 1/2 inch outside the fender supports.  Could be bent in a bit, but I don't want to crack the chrome.  I hoped to clamp them onto the fender supports like GlennF's installation, but they're too wide.

Photo 4: same with the right side... too wide.

Any suggestions or ideas?

[GlennF]

I do not have the bike at work today but when I get a chance will unbolt the rack and take some photos of the mounts.

One difference I have noticed is the rear mount on my bike has a slot not a hole.

[gremlin]

Your B5 rack (the first one) needs a set of the half-circle clips that are used on the front mounting of the pillion seat (the rear seat mate of your front seat)

you would also need to drill a second hole in the rack leg above the mounting rail.

[sparklow]

This is just a guess, so take it for what it is worth. I also have a B5. The frame, back fender of our bikes is similar or the same as the home market Indian 350s. I wonder if we would need to source a rack that would fit those home market bikes?

[mattsz]

Gremlin - can you elaborate about the "half-circle clips" you mentioned?  Or better yet, a photo or web link?

Sparklow - you may be right, but it's difficult to communicate sometimes.  I checked with royalenfieldzone.com  regarding this rack:
http://www.royalenfieldzone.com/view_large.asp?Id=2466
Look familiar?  I received assurance that it would fit my bike, and that it cost $150 and another $100 to ship to the US. 

I asked again for confirmation of that price in US$.  So... don't think I'll be ordering from them any time soon!

[mattsz]

Your B5 rack (the first one) needs a set of the half-circle clips that are used on the front mounting of the pillion seat (the rear seat mate of your front seat)

you would also need to drill a second hole in the rack leg above the mounting rail.

Ahh...  I think I see what you're getting at now, Gremlin:

[mattsz]

I just looked at the NFG photo of the black rack, and it shows two bolts with sleeves.  Sure enough, I found them at the bottom of the box.  But, I still don't see how to make it fit.  That bolt would have to replace the shock mount bolt, and it's the wrong size - too short, too small.

[mattsz]

I do not have the bike at work today but when I get a chance will unbolt the rack and take some photos of the mounts.

One difference I have noticed is the rear mount on my bike has a slot not a hole.

If you want to snap a closeup photo or two of the hardware while mounted, that would be ok, but please don't remove the rack from your bike!  I can see how it fits just fine from the other photos you've posted here.  I was hoping that the rack I bought would be close, like yours, but clearly it's much wider than the one you got.

Still pondering a way to fabricate a bracket that will work, and won't be too ugly, for those wide front arms.

Lock that rack up at night! 

[gremlin]

Ahh...  I think I see what you're getting at now, Gremlin:

and those half-moon clips are properly angled as well,  they are made for clamping round that stock at an angle !

[Arizoni]

If I was going to install that G5 rack I would mount the forward two legs to the tubular frame using an AN742 or MS9024 type clamp on each side to secure it.  Use this link to see what the AN742 clamp looks like.

http://www.everyspec.com/Clamp/AN735_THRU_AN742/

Although the jet engine business uses hundreds of these kind of clamps (usually cushioned to provide support for tubing) they are not a common item carried by hardware stores so I would buy some steel "plumbers tape" and make my own.

Plumbers tape is the roll of steel with holes punched thru it.  It is used to make supports for pipe and tubing.  It is easily cut with metal cutting shears or a hack saw and it is easy to bend it to wrap around a tube.
Here's a link to some plumbers tape if you want to see a picture
http://compare.ebay.com/like/370034111375?var=lv&ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar

After making my home made clamps I would wrap them around the frames tube with the straight leg towards the fender and hanging down below the tube.
The front legs of the luggage rack would extend down below my home made clamp and either be bent outward to match the clamps location (best) or I would use a stack of washers between the downward leg of the clamp and the faces of the racks front tubes (not the best).

The plumbers tape and any washers or spacers used would be painted black.

[mattsz]

Arizoni -

Now you've got me thinking.  Angled loop-type clamps like you mentioned...  spacers...  I have lengths of black delrin rod, both 1/2 and 3/4 inch, which I can machine to any size I want - prob'ly would make a good spacer.  Hmmmm.....

Still waiting to hear from NFG guys about how the rack that is supposed to fit, is supposed to fit...

[Arizoni]

As I mentioned, using spacers between the two forward rack legs and the tube clamps isn't the best idea.

Because the load will be straight down on the rack, the offset between the legs and the supporting clamps will create a torque which is constantly trying to twist the lower ends of the clamps down.  This will result in a turning force that will try to bend the clamps outward.

If you just bite the bullet (pun intended) and bend the two front legs outward about 1 inch and then bend the lower area so it is perpendicular to the ground, the load on the clamps will be straight down.
This too will try to rotate the clamps but because their vertical surfaces are right up against the racks legs they cannot rotate.

[mattsz]

Arizoni-

Just so we're clear - are you talking about mounting the black B5 rack (which doesn't fit my B5), or are you talking about mounting the G5 rack (which also doesn't fit my B5)?

I thought you were talking about the G5 rack - I can't see bending any parts of the rack without busting up the chrome.  I'm worried about breaking the other rack's arms if I try to bend them...

[gremlin]

...  I have lengths of black delrin rod, both 1/2 and 3/4 inch......

Should I ask ?   

[Arizoni]

I'm talking about the chrome G5 rack.

Yes, there is a chance of the chrome plating chipping when the tubes are bent but unless you plan on sending the rack back or your just making a "rack collection" where only undamaged racks will do, what's to loose?
If the chrome did chip, you could always use the "Indian Chrome Paint", commonly called "Aluminum colored paint", and everything would look like it was a factory original.

[mattsz]

Should I ask ?   

bushings for hurdy-gurdy axles: http://www.midcoast.com/~beechhil/vielle/

On second thought, don't ask...

[barenekd]

Get a couple of these clamps for the front. Drill the rear and mount the on the existing stubs.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/ms21919clamps2.php

As for my experiences with Nfield Gear, the only things I've gotten from them were the Tribar headlight and ring mounts, which were OK, EFI muffler, OK, Rearset footpegs which took a little modifying and chasing down bolts, but came out very nicely, and a clubman seat for an Electra which fit the bike perfectly, quality is lacking a bit, I've done some modifying to the foam and cover, but it still needs some work.
Bare

[Arizoni]

As I mentioned after installing the luggage rack on my G5, it seemed to have been made by someone without any access to the real dimensioned drawings for the bike from RE.

After they got it to fit the bike they had on hand at the moment, they then removed it and used a rusty tape measure to determine the locations and sizes for the mounting holes.
Using these newly found dimensions they started producing their racks.

I suppose on the bright side, every RE that has racks, crash bars etc. mounted on it can correctly claim to be 100 percent "custom" as each one of these things must be customized to fit the motorcycle your riding.

[mattsz]

Arizoni - a collection of undamaged racks?  That sounds like a great idea!  Maybe I should keep them both, and mount one so I can carry around the other.

I plan on keeping one, and sending the other back, so I have to make sure I don't damage either one before I decide.  As much as I prefer the look of the G5 "fantail" chrome rack, I'm now leaning toward the Bullet flat rack as being more functional: large items will sit flat on it rather than tipped up on the other.

Tim at NFG says that there is missing mounting hardware for the Bullet rack, which he can get in about a week - he's never seen it, and he doesn't have any information regarding the fit and finish of it, so I guess I'm waiting to see what he comes up with.

meanwhile, Bare, I'll look for those loop-type clamps, or more likely make my own, for the bullet rack.

[gremlin]

Any update on this ?   Photos of the completed installation would be nice !

[mattsz]

So I've settled on the NField Gear black rack which comes with a removable seat pad.  The fit and finish is the usual quality, I'm afraid.  It came with some rusty hardware which just didn't make sense; when I asked Tim about it he said that there was some other special mounting hardware to fit the rack which he would be getting for me.  It arrived eventually, but I still couldn't see how to make it work to mount the rack, which is supposed to be a custom fit for my bike.

Tim inquired of his supplier, who sent him "instructions", reproduced here for your edification (image: "rack instr").  Not what I'd call instructions; anyway as near as I can tell, the suggestion is to replace the upper shock mount bolts with the new ones, and use the included spacers to fit the rack.  But the new hardware still doesn't fit - the bolts are too long and would strike the fender if I used them.  Also, the nuts and bolts seem to be a size or two smaller than the current hardware holding the shock, so it just seemed too dicey to even consider.

I ended up going with what I'm going to call "b" shaped hose or piping clamps, of the style suggested by barenekd above.  I found some sturdy ones that were dipped in vinyl, perfect for mounting to my fender supports.  I also collected some stainless metric hardware including nyloc nuts.  I could have used the seat mount hardware for the racks rear support arms, but I decided to go with new.

It's not clear from the photos, but I had to bend the flat portion of the rack's forward support arms outward a bit so they would clear the fender and leave enough room to fit the bolt head.  The rack's rear support arms fit into the rear seat tabs.  You might just see the bends in the first photo (image: "rack 1_notes), which shows the front mounting from above.  Notice in the photo how the rack mounts line up with the shock mounts.  I might have been able to find some different shock mount hardware to fit, but I decided that my current setup would be easier to remove if I want to take the rack off.

The next photo (image: "rack 2") shows a side view of the front mount - the clamp I used is obvious.  The front of the rack is mounted a little higher than it would be if I used the shock mounts, but the rack is basically level as it is.

[mattsz]

The third photo (image: "rack 3") shows the rear mount - straight forward, but observe the poor quality powdercoating.

Photo 4 (image: "rack 4") shows the overall mount.

Photo 5 (image: "rack 5") shows the bigger picture.

Now to find a box I can use on it.  Mostly I want to be able to strap on a bag or extra clothing layers, but when I go to work on the first day of my 7-day week, I carry more gear than my cheap bags hold.  Today I clamped a red milk crate to the rack - my coworkers weren't impressed.  I tried to explain the safety benefits of a high-visibility red crate, but they wouldn't be swayed. 

[Jack Leis]

Looks great Mattz !

[motorat]

i have a box thast came with my vstrom.
i set it on the rack i have on my RE.
when i get home i will post the pic.

it looks alot like this:
http://www.cariboucases.com/store/?name=Catalog&mode=i&item=000355

[gremlin]

.....I tried to explain the safety benefits of a high-visibility red crate ..... 

  

[gremlin]

Awesome !   Thanks for the photos !   
This just made my to-do list !

[mattsz]

For the curious: the rack is NField Gear's "Rear Carrier/Pillion Seat" for Bullet, #Z90205.  Original price 149.95, it's offered (and I bought it) at a special price of $104.97.  Still too expensive by half, in my opinion, but it is what it is:

http://nfieldgear.com/enfield-store/aftermarket-parts-accessories/luggage/rear-carrier-pillion-seat.html

The seat pad isn't comfortable.  I'd love to have one of these sprung pillion seats for it:

http://nfieldgear.com/enfield-store/aftermarket-parts-accessories/seats/old-fashioned-pillion.html

But I'm not sure it would fit, and anyway I don't have any prospective passengers for it.  It's another $90 I can use somewhere else...

[Ragmas]

The third photo (image: "rack 3") shows the rear mount - straight forward, but observe the poor quality powdercoating.

Photo 4 (image: "rack 4") shows the overall mount.

Photo 5 (image: "rack 5") shows the bigger picture.

Now to find a box I can use on it.  Mostly I want to be able to strap on a bag or extra clothing layers, but when I go to work on the first day of my 7-day week, I carry more gear than my cheap bags hold.  Today I clamped a red milk crate to the rack - my coworkers weren't impressed.  I tried to explain the safety benefits of a high-visibility red crate, but they wouldn't be swayed. 

I have the same bags but without the part that goes over the fender.  Do you know what model they are?  I want to see if I can find the part so I can hang them all proper like.

Sam

[mattsz]

I have the same bags but without the part that goes over the fender.  Do you know what model they are?  I want to see if I can find the part so I can hang them all proper like.

Sam

Hey Sam-

Mine are "Waterproof Classic Biker Motorcycle Saddlebags" by Xelement, purchased from LeatherUp.com:

https://www.leatherup.com/p/Motorcycle-Saddlebags/Waterproof-Classic-Biker-Motorcycle-Saddlebags/49964.html

If you have the same bags, you know that they're nothing special.  I wasn't prepared to plunk down a chunk of change on high-quality bags without having a clear idea of what size or shape or attachment style I would want.  So I got these because they were fairly cheap and the right size.  And they almost weren't that, since, as I said in my product review, the given dimensions were clearly external, and not quite right at that.  Fortunately, the items I need to carry for work do just fit.

I don't know if you can get just the support "strap" that holds them up.  Mine is scuffing up the top of my fender a bit.  The bags attach to the support strap with a zipper, edged on each side by velcro.

[Jack Leis]

Here is my contribution to the thread. I mounted this rack a couple of days ago. Hitchcock's Electra/G5 rear carrier. I like it !

[mattsz]

Looks good, Jack!  But... what can you tell me about those rear turn signals?

[Jack Leis]

Thanks MattsZ, the turn signals are from Chaparral, a local motorcycle super parts store in this area. I believe they are Bikemasters. I really cant remember. I really despised the stock signals, thus the change. I got the idea from Bare. I put them on the front as well.

[LarsBloodbeard]

I might have to grab some of those turn signals too...  They look flat black.  Did they come that way or did you paint them?

[mattsz]

Are they LED?

[Jack Leis]

They came matted black. They are incandescent. I put the brightest LED's I could get to fit in them and they were actually less bright then the originals. They work fairly well for their size. They are NOT D.O.T. approved but WTF , running them anyway.

[barenekd]

The same turn signals are available from Cycle Gear. Leave the stock bulbs in them. They are a pain to change to start with, then you have to go through the hassles of setting up LEDs for the turn signals. and they are quite bright.
Bare

[LarsBloodbeard]

x

[mplayle]

Kind of an "On Topic" hijack here.

Jack, could you provide a few more details on your setup?  I'm strongly considering getting a new C5 model and want to at least put some form of saddle-bags and rack on it.  Which bike model and what rack/bags arrangement are you running?  Thanks.

[Jack Leis]

Kind of an "On Topic" hijack here.

Jack, could you provide a few more details on your setup?  I'm strongly considering getting a new C5 model and want to at least put some form of saddle-bags and rack on it.  Which bike model and what rack/bags arrangement are you running?  Thanks.

Your not hijacking anymore then that damn Larsbloodbeard does. Its a 2011 G5 , I have River Road Medium Slanted Saddlebags, Nfield Gear Saddlebag Brackets behind them and the Rear Carrier is from Hitchcock's. I hope this has helped.

[LarsBloodbeard]

Your not hijacking anymore then that damn Larsbloodbeard does.

D'oh.  Sorry.

[mattsz]

mplayle - you didn't hijack the thread, you brought it back on topic!

And Jack, to be fair to Larsbloodbeard (this time, anyway), I was the one who asked about the lights.  Is it bad etiquette to hijack your own thread? 

[mplayle]

Thanks for the information Jack, it does help.  I can look up the specifics with what you provided.

The "hijack" comments gave me a well needed giggle this morning.

Cheers!

[gremlin]

Is it bad etiquette to hijack your own thread? 

it's ok behind closed doors .....

[mattsz]

Some further details about my rack mounting...

Bare suggested these, or something like it:

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/ms21919clamps2.php

I found them at my local hardware store, but I wasn't impressed with their strength, and the slip-on cushioning didn't wow me either.  But then I found a similar style of clip, but made heavier - steel possibly?  It was still bendable, but not like the aluminum.  Also, they were dipped in some kind of liquid vinyl coating which gave it a nice thick stable cushion.  The "proper" size clips (5/8" maybe?) were too tight, and didn't close up around the frame well, due to the thickness of the vinyl coating.  I ended up getting 3/4" clips, which when tightened down, gripped the frame pretty well - just slightly moveable, but when I mounted all four rack points and torqued everything, the rack is rock solid.  And I trust the clamps for cargo carrying, or for a pillion rider on short hops.

As for the sprung pillion seat, I can't tell what's going on with the rear mount for the NFG one:

http://nfieldgear.com/enfield-store/aftermarket-parts-accessories/seats/old-fashioned-pillion.html

But the Hitchcocks one looks like a simple bolt-on:

http://www.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/http://assets.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/pictures/category4404/large/91402.jpg

My rack does *not* fit my bike as shown in the Hitchcocks photo.  The fender is seriously in the way of that extended shock mount bolt...

[Arizoni]

If you can find a source, those MS21919 clamps come in many different materials.

For instance, a MS21919CF12 is a stainless steel for a 3/4" tube with a nitrile pad.

http://www.everyspec.com/MS-Specs/MS2/MS21000-MS21999/MS21919E_11247/

We used these all over our turbine engines to support tubing and wiring harnesses.

[mplayle]

In poking around and comparing the NField model Z90205 with the options found on the Hitchcock's site, I think I figured out the original problem: The Z90205 model is for the shallow (newer?) style rear fender.  The NField site does not list the option for the deeper (older/350?) style rear fender.  The Hitchcock's site has different versions for each fender style and a note on the general listing indicating which to order for the different fender depths.

The information already listed in this thread helped put the pieces together.

This thread has also provided great insight into the creative problem solving the RE community shares - very refreshing and wonderful to see.

Cheers.