HPRE

Menu

Members Rides

lookin' good so far 09'


in
Members Rides

42 Guests, 3 Users
Blltrdr, Mike_D, solg
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
October 26, 2014, 03:52:30 AM

Login with username, password and session length

 

Author Topic: Valve & rocker wear.  (Read 2983 times)

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Valve & rocker wear.
« on: November 08, 2012, 06:22:58 AM »
Been adjusting my pushrod longer every morning for the past couple days.  Thought maybe the pushrod was collapsing or bending, but this morning I adjusted it again and there was still a loud tap-tap-tapping as if it had a lot of slop.  Also it ran like crap.  So this evening I pulled the pushrod access panel off and slowly rotated the engine with the kicker and it clicked with every downstroke of the exhaust pushrod.  I took the valve cover off & the rocker, and here's what I saw.... What happened here?!  Note: I just had a valve job done by a reputable machinist.

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2012, 06:43:52 AM »
Here's the other side, for comparison.  The valve cap isn't squished like a pancake, but the rocker is showing signs of fresh wear.

Bullet Whisperer

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 491
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2012, 09:32:34 AM »
Any chance of some close ups of the rocker tips - where they make contact with the valve stem? From what I can see at the moment, your rocker tips look like nothing I have seen before on an Enfield and it makes me wonder if they have been messed with?
 B.W.

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2012, 01:53:01 PM »
Well, with that kind of problem with the exhaust side, you are going to have to re-check the valve guide to be sure it hasn't been harmed by that. Assuming the valve guide is still in-spec, you really only have to fix the valve parts that are bad, and get new rockers. Perhaps pushrods, if they are bent like you mentioned.
I'd recommend getting the Samrat rockers, and drilling out the oil hole in the rocker blocks from 2mm standard size hole, up to 1/8" or 3mm size hole. It's an aluminum block design, very easy to drill, and the holes are very short. It's an easy home job. The Samrat rockers are better designed.

That's a fairly unusual thing that you had happen there. I have seen some failures in that area, but not so severe. From what I have seen before, if it has been getting that bad for a while, it could transfer the damage to the pushrod, which we have seen. And it is also possible to have some damage transfer down to the lifter and to the cam. In the last Bullet I saw with lesser problem, but similar, the pushrod was bent, and the cam nose had unusual wear. The lifter seemed to have been spared. These things should all be looked at, if possible.

Regarding those rockers, I have seen some Bullet rockers like that. Your intake side rocker pad pattern seems fairly normal, if a bit long. This exposes the typical wrong rocker geometry that is seen on Bullets. But, it isn't bad, and it's centered, and it's not falling off the valve lash cap. The further that wear pattern goes toward the edge, the more side-force is placed on the valve, causing higher valve guide wear than necessary.
I would say that virtually all street Bullets suffer from some "less than ideal" rocker geometry issues.

It won't be a terribly expensive fix, and it's not a very labor intensive job to fix these things that have gone bad. It's not really all that bad in the overall scheme of things that can go wrong with a Bullet.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2012, 02:04:41 PM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

ERC

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1547
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2012, 02:15:22 PM »
Looks like the valve keeper let the valve get pushed down in the spring.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2012, 04:07:41 PM »
Thanks, guys.  Would this be the fault of the machine shop?  Or just a random failure?  These were fine 80 miles ago.  The valve tip collapsing into the spring makes a lot of sense as to why I suddenly had to lengthen my pushrod.

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2012, 04:13:51 PM »
Thanks, guys.  Would this be the fault of the machine shop?  Or just a random failure?  These were fine 80 miles ago.  The valve tip collapsing into the spring makes a lot of sense as to why I suddenly had to lengthen my pushrod.

It's very difficult to say. Maybe there will be more clues when you get it apart.
The tapered arrangement with which these valves are attached to the upper spring retainer is very hard to get it wrong. They pull themselves together.  But I guess incorrect assembly could somehow be possible. Or a combination of a partially failing part not being noticed by the assembler, and then a failure there after.

It could be various reasons, one of which is that the parts often aren't too great to begin with.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

ERC

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1547
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2012, 05:43:13 PM »
Like Ace says take it apart I think the reason for it will be obvious.   ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

Chasfield

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1395
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2012, 06:45:56 PM »
Looks like quite a lot of powdered steel could have washed down into the timing case. Maybe a good idea to pull the cover off and clean out with solvent. Inspect the condition of the oil pump drive while you are in there.

Did the exhaust valve stem cap jump out and leave the the softer valve stem to be eaten away by the rocker? If so, where did the cap finish up. Or was one actually fitted?

It looks like the valve stem is eaten away down to the collets and ready to let go, so the assembly should be treated with caution until a valve spring compressor has been applied.
2001 500 Bullet Deluxe

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2012, 09:19:07 PM »
Good idea, Chasfield.  I need to check the condition of the cams anyway.  I looked around in the head and didn't see anything.  I don't have a spring compressor, unfortunately.  Shopped around for one at the local parts stores and nobody had one that would work.  Tomorrow I'll take it down to the machine shop and have them pop the valves out.  Then we'll see what went on there...

Arizoni

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 4452
  • Karma: 1
  • "But it's a dry heat here in Arizona
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2012, 09:48:14 PM »
Admittedly, my Iron Barrel manual is for an old British engine but it clearly shows a cylindrical steel "stem cap" sitting against the end of the valve above the split collars.

I assume the Indian engines have a similar cap in their engines?

The nose of the rocker arm pushes against this (I assume, hardened) steel cap.

The exhaust valve in the photo looks like the rocker arm has been pushing directly against it, hence the excessive wear on the stem.

Were these hardened steel "stem caps" in the upper spring retainers pocket between the rocker arms and the valve stems?
If not, there is the source of the problem.
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

ERC

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1547
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2012, 10:40:15 PM »
Most of the Bullets have the caps, unless the shop that did the job used different valves. It's possible they threw the valves in a pile and the caps got lost.  ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2012, 11:19:57 PM »
The lash cap appears to be in position on the intake valve picture.
I can't tell what's there in that crushed mess on the exhaust valve.
It just needs to be disassembled and inspected.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

Arizoni

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 4452
  • Karma: 1
  • "But it's a dry heat here in Arizona
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2012, 11:56:48 PM »
Your eyes must be better than mine.

In the two pictures of the intake valve I think I clearly see the two split collars and the end of the valve stem?

I picture (in my mind) the stem cap as being a cylindrical disk that fits nicely into the pocket in the upper part of the valve spring retainer.
It should have a nicely ground finish on both faces.

IMO, if it were in place I wouldn't be able to see the end of the valve stem or the split collars but what do I know?   :D
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2012, 01:15:13 AM »
Here's a picture of what they look like.


They snap over the top of the valve tip on top.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2012, 01:29:45 AM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

Arizoni

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 4452
  • Karma: 1
  • "But it's a dry heat here in Arizona
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2012, 01:27:29 AM »
Thanks.

Getting back to LarsBloodbeard, did you find two of those things in there?
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2012, 01:56:30 AM »
There was nothing floating around inside the head.  Judging by the way it looks, I'm leaning towards the cap not being present.  Not sure how that could have happened though, unless it wasn't present from the time I got it back from the machinist.

I tore that head off in record time, but not quick enough to get to the shop before they close.

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #17 on: November 09, 2012, 02:18:31 AM »
If you have the tappet cover removed, you can look around inside the tappet galley to see if any lash cap is down in there. That's as far as it could drop, if it stayed in one piece.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #18 on: November 09, 2012, 04:29:49 AM »
If you have the tappet cover removed, you can look around inside the tappet galley to see if any lash cap is down in there. That's as far as it could drop, if it stayed in one piece.

Checked there too.  Nada.

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2012, 12:53:20 PM »
Just to satisfy my curiosity, and since the lash caps look just like what is in the photo on your intake valve, would you check to see if that is a cap on there, or not?
It should just pull right off with a pair of needle-nose pliers, without any damage.

If there are no lash caps anywhere to be found, then it was assembled without lash caps, and that's what caused it.

If there is a lash cap on the intake, and not on the exhaust, then that could be the reason why the exhaust failed. Or perhaps the exhaust lash cap broke apart. I have seen them severely damaged on the top before, but never actually coming apart. But it could happen.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #20 on: November 10, 2012, 12:09:44 AM »
No cap on the intake valve!  Well,  that explains it.

I really thought they were on there, but i guess the patina on the stem fooled me.

Dhastings1954

  • 98 bullet Machismo
  • Neophyte
  • *
  • Posts: 22
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #21 on: November 10, 2012, 01:58:40 PM »
Interesting problem. Just replaced the rocker assemblies in my bullet.  In my case I did not remove or replace the valve stem caps shown in the last picture. Did not look like there was much wear there and the rockers themselves did not have the same wear as shown in the picture for the exhaust valve.  In my case the rockers were not getting oil, so the bearing surface was completely worn out and the shafts had lateral movement. It certainly appears that the cap was simply issuing on the exhaust valve.

I am wondering now if I should have replaced the caps when I did my rocker assemblies?
Duncan
Vt Bullet

Chasfield

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1395
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #22 on: November 10, 2012, 05:06:10 PM »
If they looked ok with only light contact marks then I am sure the valve stem caps will be fine.

My experience is that the caps can be very difficult to remove once they have been run for a few thousand miles. I think the soft valve stem grows into them. The last two times, I have had to resort to taking out the retaining collets with the caps in place, letting valve spring pressure (and taps with a soft hammer) drive the caps off into a containing sack. No way could I get them off by just pulling on them, even though they did not have an excessively tight fit when I installed them.
2001 500 Bullet Deluxe

ERC

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1547
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #23 on: November 10, 2012, 11:52:52 PM »
Chas is correct on the caps last time I used a little heat and they came right off.   ERC
2-57 Apaches, 2-57 Trailblazers, 60 Chief, 65 Interceptor, 2004 Bullet, 612 Bullet chopped.

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #24 on: November 11, 2012, 08:15:35 AM »
Chas is correct on the caps last time I used a little heat and they came right off.   ERC

Well, I yanked on the end of that intake valve for a while with pliers, and tried to pry it from the side.  It hardly has any miles on it.  So it seems like there's no cap on there to me.  Odd that the intake would survive and not the exhaust though.  The intake valve is way softer metal than the exhaust.

Dhastings1954

  • 98 bullet Machismo
  • Neophyte
  • *
  • Posts: 22
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #25 on: November 11, 2012, 12:54:08 PM »
What Chasfield said about the caps being hard to get off makes sense. Of course if you use heat to get the cap off, you run the risk of annealing the cap.

The picture sure looked like there was a cap on the intake and not on the exhaust. You have to wonder if the machine shop lost one of the caps or simply missed it when they put it back together.

Did they grind and re-seat the existing valves or replace everything?
Duncan
Vt Bullet

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #26 on: November 11, 2012, 04:54:04 PM »
I cleaned everything in the head and lapped the valves.  When I brought it in for assembly they said the seats were too wide, so I asked them to fix that.

Blltrdr

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1763
  • Karma: 0
  • cycle-delic music
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #27 on: November 11, 2012, 06:45:58 PM »
Your eyes must be better than mine.

In the two pictures of the intake valve I think I clearly see the two split collars and the end of the valve stem?

I picture (in my mind) the stem cap as being a cylindrical disk that fits nicely into the pocket in the upper part of the valve spring retainer.
It should have a nicely ground finish on both faces.

IMO, if it were in place I wouldn't be able to see the end of the valve stem or the split collars but what do I know?   :D

You need to scroll to the top of the page and check out the valve in question.
2003 Classic 500 5 spd
1992 Kawasaki ZG 1200 Voyager XII
1977 Yamaha XS 360-2D (Cafe Project)

Arizoni

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 4452
  • Karma: 1
  • "But it's a dry heat here in Arizona
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2012, 07:37:28 PM »

When I made that observation I was speaking of the two pictures in the second post of this topic.  That is why I mentioned the two pictures of the intake valve.

There is no question that the valve cap is missing on the exhaust valve and, indeed, the entire stem end of the exhaust valve in the photo shown in the first post of this topic has been worn away.
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

edthetermite

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 289
  • Karma: 0
  • The Emperor has no skin.
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #29 on: November 12, 2012, 02:35:51 AM »
I cleaned everything in the head and lapped the valves.  When I brought it in for assembly they said the seats were too wide, so I asked them to fix that.

I think you will be able to rightfully expect them to "fix" your present problem  as well. Leaving the caps off qualifies as a legitimate liability I would think.
Ed   - Long Live the Iron Barrel !!!!

Visit MisterEdsWoodworking @ Etsy.com

2008 Military RE 535    2006 Ural Gear Up

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #30 on: November 12, 2012, 11:08:57 AM »
One thing to know about taking anything for your Bullet to some machine shop is that nobody knows about Bullets, and you have to tell them specifically what to do, and double check everything after they do it.

Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #31 on: November 17, 2012, 07:50:31 AM »
UPS dropped off my valves, rockers, etc. today... at 7pm.  :(
Really wish I had a valve spring compressor about now.  Oh well, Monday I'll drop it all off at the machine shop.

edthetermite

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 289
  • Karma: 0
  • The Emperor has no skin.
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #32 on: November 17, 2012, 04:19:20 PM »
One thing to know about taking anything for your Bullet to some machine shop is that nobody knows about Bullets, and you have to tell them specifically what to do, and double check everything after they do it.

I had very good success sending my stuff to Tennessee.  ;)
Ed   - Long Live the Iron Barrel !!!!

Visit MisterEdsWoodworking @ Etsy.com

2008 Military RE 535    2006 Ural Gear Up

Afro Samurai

  • Bulleteer
  • ***
  • Posts: 138
  • Karma: 0
  • Afro Samurai
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #33 on: November 17, 2012, 11:56:47 PM »
I am in the tenn / north alabama area...
So tell me more...who are the good bullet mechanics in this region ?...

AgentX

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1157
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #34 on: November 18, 2012, 03:16:31 PM »
I am in the tenn / north alabama area...
So tell me more...who are the good bullet mechanics in this region ?...

He's talking about Ace who posted above, although he's a performance specialist not a general mechanic.

Afro Samurai

  • Bulleteer
  • ***
  • Posts: 138
  • Karma: 0
  • Afro Samurai
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #35 on: November 19, 2012, 12:48:08 AM »
Perfect...need to send those guys a message...so can get a 535 built ...all the trimmings..get my ride looking as slick as yours....and move through traffic better....

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #36 on: November 19, 2012, 05:25:37 PM »
I'd love to have Ace.cafe rebuild my engine.  I just can't afford it.  Maybe someday...

Dropped off the parts at the machine shop.  They said the caps were never in the box of parts when I returned it after cleaning the head and lapping the valves.  That's ridiculous because I peeked in the box and they were indeed there, and I never took them out -- I had no reason to.  They're trying to cover their asses I guess.  Oh well, at least new valves and rockers weren't terribly expensive and I have better than stock now.

Edit: Just got a call from the shop.  They said the Kibblewhite exhaust valve I got from CMW doesn't fit the seat correctly.  WTH?!
« Last Edit: November 19, 2012, 11:34:46 PM by LarsBloodbeard »

LarsBloodbeard

  • Grease Monkey
  • ****
  • Posts: 303
  • Karma: 0
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #37 on: November 26, 2012, 05:37:27 PM »
Finally I got my head back from the machinist, with the new black diamond valves installed. 

I was going to smear some clay on top of the piston to be sure the valves weren't going to hit, but I dug out my box of sculpting clay and found it had dried out completely.  So I shined a bore light down the compressor hole while looking down the spark hole and rotating the engine.  Maybe not the best test, but it looked like there was plenty of space in there when at TDC.  There should be anyway, with the 2mm spacer at the bottom of the barrel.

Fired it up and wow... I was really impressed with how quiet the engine is now!  Did my plug chops and put in some richer jets.  Hope all is well from now on!

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8537
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Valve & rocker wear.
« Reply #38 on: November 26, 2012, 05:51:14 PM »
Finally I got my head back from the machinist, with the new black diamond valves installed. 

I was going to smear some clay on top of the piston to be sure the valves weren't going to hit, but I dug out my box of sculpting clay and found it had dried out completely.  So I shined a bore light down the compressor hole while looking down the spark hole and rotating the engine.  Maybe not the best test, but it looked like there was plenty of space in there when at TDC.  There should be anyway, with the 2mm spacer at the bottom of the barrel.

Fired it up and wow... I was really impressed with how quiet the engine is now!  Did my plug chops and put in some richer jets.  Hope all is well from now on!

Congratulations!
I'll bet that made for a Happy Thanksgiving, even if it was a few days after!
Enjoy!
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info