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Author Topic: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment  (Read 2022 times)

bitphire

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2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« on: November 26, 2012, 08:30:18 PM »
Hi, just got this bike from a friend and said the valve needs adjusting. It's says on the sticker it's 2008 Royal Enfield Bullet Electra X Classic. I was trying to use http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bmgJPyCUNU as a guide but the cover he removes to adjust them has a wire connected to it. So want to check and see if that video will still work as a good guide.

Thank you,
Steven

Also, I am trying to find a copy of the service manual if anyone knows where to get online.

Arizoni

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2012, 10:45:52 PM »
The video you linked shows how to adjust the valves on a Iron Barrel engine.

You have an AVL engine which (I believe) has the decompression device built into the pushrod cover plate.  The Iron barrels locate their decompression valve on the cylinder head.

The exhaust valve lifter on the AVL has an area on it which engages the decompression lever but beyond that, everything else in there is similar to the old Iron Barrel so you would do it like the video shows it.
Jim
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barenekd

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2012, 11:21:06 PM »
That wire on the tappet cover has got to be a ground wire for something. It certainly doesn't operate anything under that cover. You need to trace it back and see what it's connected to. It's not standard equipment as far as I've ever seen on an AVL.
The valve adjustment should be the same as the video.
Bare
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tooseevee

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2012, 01:26:54 AM »
That wire on the tappet cover has got to be a ground wire for something. It certainly doesn't operate anything under that cover. You need to trace it back and see what it's connected to. It's not standard equipment as far as I've ever seen on an AVL.
The valve adjustment should be the same as the video.
Bare

           He's not seeing a "wire" wire. I think what he's looking at is the decompressor cable. If you don't fool with the adjustments, you just take the cover off & put it back. It all just falls back in place. 
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bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2012, 05:26:33 AM »
Thank you for that information Arizoni!

Quote
He's not seeing a "wire" wire. I think what he's looking at is the decompressor cable. If you don't fool with the adjustments, you just take the cover off & put it back. It all just falls back in place.
It is a cable and so I would likely assume that it is the decompression cable but will have to check tomorrow. The battery was dead so left it to charge the rest of the night.
That statement put me off a little, we are adjusting the valves as they are tight. Since we are adjusting, is there going to be an issue with putting the plate back on?


Just wanted to say thank you for all the useful information. I really appreciate it and my girlfriend will to (this is her first bike)

bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2012, 05:56:43 AM »
I really appreciate the info on my post. We are going to attempt to adjust the valves tomorrow and see if we can get her to start. The only problem is, I have no clue how to start it. I have started dirt bikes before, clutch in and kick (choke if needed). Though, on this one from some reading I have done, it's not as simple as that. lol

So here's hoping you can give a quick run down on what I need to do to try and start it and what to listen/look for if it does or does not start.

The bike was purchased from a friend of a family member and I will go to him as a last resort but he said he bets the bike will start once the valves get adjusted, I just don't know how long it's been sitting in his garage.

Also, I am still trying to find a manual so I can price/order it. Is there a more common name for this bike too? I keep searching google for 2008 Royal Enfield Electra X AVL Manual and not coming up with a lot of answers.

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #6 on: November 27, 2012, 05:16:02 PM »
Before starting
1. fresh gas
2. new spark plug

 Avoid e-start if you can

Typical starting procedure:
1. Put bike on Centre Stand; side stand up
2. Ignition off
3. bike in neutral
4. pull in clutch and kick through a couple times to disengage the clutch plates
5. Push the decomp (not too easy but can be done while kicking the bike through) with a wide open throttle (prevents loading the combustion chamber with too much fuel) and kick through  a few times to get the oil moving
6. Set piston to TDC
7. Ignition on; emergency kill switch (red switch on the right handlebar cluster) off
8. Solid kick, dont go ballistic though. Repeat 6,7,8 if required.

If it does not start:
1. Check you on/off switches, side stand
2. Check spark (get fresh spark plug)
3. Check fuel (get fresh gas)
4. Check air filter

« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 05:21:01 PM by 1 Thump »

barenekd

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2012, 05:36:29 PM »
How to find TDC, (or just past it). Leave the kill button or side stand down, ignition switch on, until you have done all the preceding chores listed above. Push the kickstarter until you feel the  piston resisting movement, then, with the decomp pulled, ease the piston on up until you see the ammeter center. I would just give it a slight nudge past that point, then release the decomp, turn on the kill switch or raise the side stand,, and kick it through with some gusto. You do this because when you get to the compression stroke again, the flywheel will have enough inertia built up to push the piston through compression with little wear and tear on you and the kickstarting gears.
Should start right up.
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boggy

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2012, 06:34:55 PM »
I use the Pete Snidal manual for my 2007 AVL, although I don't recall paying $55 for it!!!  Holy smokes.

Between that and the forums I've had my bases covered.

http://nfieldgear.com/enfield-store/maintenance-repair/manuals/snidal-repair-guide-spiral-bound.html

My AVL's e-start has never functioned for me. My 10 mile each way city commute isn't enough to keep the battery charged so it's kick-only. I do think a kick start bike is tough for a newbie as it requires getting back on the center-stand and kicking after every stall (not to mention perfecting the kick).  Maybe you can sort out your e-start better than I have. I never use it.

« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 06:37:34 PM by boggy »
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boggy

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2012, 06:41:44 PM »
My kick starting routine is slightly different, but it goes 1st kick usually.

I turn the bike on but kill the light. Center stand down. 
With the bike in neutral, I push on the kickstart lever until it's REALLY tough to push.  I push JUST through that. It'll let up and wanna move freely but I don't do it yet. 
I let the lever come back to the top and then do one full kick through.  Be certain to kick ALL the way through. If you don't, that lever can snap back with severe force.

I'll do some decompression kicks if it's been a while but I'm not sure if it helps or not.  I use my carb's enricher in temps below 50F.
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barenekd

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2012, 07:25:35 PM »
The reference to switching off the ignition stuff, but not the key switch, you need the key on to activate the ammeter. HTis is for the bikes with EFI. I'm assuming one that has the decomp going into the side case has it. Every time you kick an EFI bike through, it shoots fuel into the injector and will flood the bike. So you need to turn of the juice to the injector to avoid that.
If it's ot EFI you can disregard the switch positions.
Bare
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Arizoni

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2012, 07:37:52 PM »
bitphire
You made a comment about starting dirt bikes and pulling the clutch in before kicking it over.

With the RE, the kick starter drives the engine crankshaft thru the clutch.
If the clutch lever is pulled in, the kick starter won't rotate the crankshaft.  It will only rotate the output side of the clutch plates.

Bottom line is, when you want the engine crankshaft to rotate DO NOT touch the clutch lever while your kicking the starter lever.

Because the bike hasn't been started for a long time, putting just a few drops of oil down the spark plug hole (while your changing the spark plug to a new one) will help to keep the piston rings from scraping the cylinder walls.
It will smoke when its first started but that should quickly stop.

Also, after adding the new fuel (regular grade octane) it wouldn't hurt to take off the float bowl from the carb and wipe out the inside.
Before replacing the float bowl, turn on the fuel tap to make sure it's working and not gummed up.  If fuel flows freely, push up on the float to make sure the fuel stops.
Do this a couple of times to wash out any crap that might have settled in the float valve.  Then, replace the carb. float bowl.

After checking the carb and replacing the spark plug you should be good to go.

Have fun! :)

PS:  These Royal Enfields have an old time transmission that takes long strong movement of the shift lever to get into the next gear.
The quick flick shifting of a dirt bike doesn't exist in this world.  ;D
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2012, 09:23:45 PM »
Wow, thank you all for the responses. I was like 10 or 11 I think the last time I road a dirt bike and it was a 1980 90cc (not sure what model or anything) but I thought I had to pull the clutch in to start. Could be wrong as I never used the clutch as my shifter was a pair of vice grips so I had to lean down to shift and wasn't able to also use clutch.

Anyway! again thank you all! Here is me (yes I am too big for this bike, well imo I am) trying to get it started.
http://youtu.be/CTOU4-mu8pQ

As you can see it will start and then die a few seconds after. I managed to repeat this multiple times. Now I know the battery is dead as to get it that far I had to put jumper cables from my truck to the bike battery. Truck was not running!

Questions:
Is it the dead battery that is causing this? I tried leaving cables on and taking them off once it started and neither kept the bike running.

Does the bike sound pretty good? (It's an iphone/youtube video so I know it's not the best) I have never heard it running so not sure what it sounds like but to me it sounded pretty good.

I will get it a new spark plug and probably flush the gas out but not able to at this moment. Valves were adjusted and then we tried the truck/bike combo to start it so not sure adjusting helped it since the battery has been bad for who knows how long. My charger said it was bad but no $$ for a new one just yet.

Any other thoughts or tips?

Thank you all again, I was so happy the first time I heard it "run" even if it lasted 3 seconds at best.

Arizoni

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2012, 09:53:45 PM »
If I were to guess (which I am), I'd say there is some junk in the bottom of the carb that's plugging up the main jet (or it could be just that the main jet is plugged).

I've seen cases where if this is the problem, the fuel will slowly seep thru the jet filling the tiny reservoir.  This could be enough to start the engine but it will die almost immediately because new fuel can't refill the reservoir.  Then in the short time that the engine is stationary new fuel can seep in.

As I say, it's only a guess.
Jim
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tooseevee

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2012, 11:30:23 PM »

That statement put me off a little, we are adjusting the valves as they are tight. Since we are adjusting, is there going to be an issue with putting the plate back on?


             I meant that if you don't adjust the decomp. you'll have no trouble with the cover & you probably wouldn't either way. Also adjusting the valves will not effect reinstalling the cover. They have nothing to do with each (which you probably know by now). 

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tooseevee

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #15 on: November 27, 2012, 11:45:43 PM »
How to find TDC, (or just past it). Leave the kill button or side stand down, ignition switch on, until you have done all the preceding chores listed above. Push the kickstarter until you feel the  piston resisting movement, then, with the decomp pulled, ease the piston on up until you see the ammeter center. I would just give it a slight nudge past that point, then release the decomp, turn on the kill switch or raise the side stand,, and kick it through with some gusto. You do this because when you get to the compression stroke again, the flywheel will have enough inertia built up to push the piston through compression with little wear and tear on you and the kickstarting gears.
Should start right up.
Bare

            Concerning the watching the ammeter tic Negative trick for finding TDC: This doesn't work on an AVL (which the subject bike is). I kicked mine twice today after it sat for 3 weeks. Started right up on the 2nd kick & just purred like a (thumping) kitten. Richener off after about 15 seconds.

             bitphire: Your bike just needs fiddling with the basics & learning the little details. Get good with the kicker & leave the electric start alone - save it for tricky traffic situations.
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bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2012, 03:07:30 AM »
Well when I had it connected to the truck so I could kick it, the electric start didn't even work so that is another project.

Hoping for more suggestions on to why it won't stay running otherwise it seems like pulling the carb off and cleaning it out might be the next step. Was hoping for something a little easier but I have a good person helping me out so we should be able to get it figured out. We might wait on the carb until we can get another battery to make sure it's not that.

It's been around 6 months since it was last started and ran. Give or a take a month as my girlfriend has clarified he did start it for her and that's what sold her to it: The bike is Her Style, it started, and it was only $500 :D

tooseevee

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2012, 03:45:32 PM »
Well when I had it connected to the truck so I could kick it, the electric start didn't even work so that is another project.

Hoping for more suggestions on to why it won't stay running otherwise it seems like pulling the carb off and cleaning it out might be the next step. Was hoping for something a little easier but I have a good person helping me out so we should be able to get it figured out. We might wait on the carb until we can get another battery to make sure it's not that.

It's been around 6 months since it was last started and ran. Give or a take a month as my girlfriend has clarified he did start it for her and that's what sold her to it: The bike is Her Style, it started, and it was only $500 :D

            Wow! She got an '08 for $500? She's way ahead already. Does it look well cared for?

             The carb (a BS-29 CV Micarb if it's stock) is pretty simple to pull off & clean. Freeing the throttle cable might give you a little trouble - just take your time. I pull then carb first, then I free the cable. Works better for me.

              I don't know what to say about your battery. If it's the original, it's probably no good. You Must have a good battery for these bikes to run good & don't use the electric start ALL the time (OR the headlight). The battery can't recover in a lot of short-trip riding & it will always let you/her down.

           If it starts & dies, starts & dies, starts & dies, it's probably fuel/carb related.

            PS: Does the headlight come on when you turn the key on?

                 
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1 Thump

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #18 on: November 28, 2012, 04:34:00 PM »
I would clean the carb first. While you are at it make a note of the jet sizes that are in there. It will help you tune it further. Also, does it still have stock muffler and air filter.

bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #19 on: November 28, 2012, 05:34:25 PM »
It was bought from a friend of my step-dad. It has 25k ish miles on it and 90% of it is all highway. The headlight itself needs replacing (got a replacement just not installed). He gave me a couple of sprockets but gonna have to get back in touch to see which one is which as I don't remember. The lens on the rear blinker needs replaced but I believe that is the majority of the issues. It was a steal.







LarsBloodbeard

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2012, 06:24:06 PM »
$500!?  Oh man, you're killing me.  I would love to have that bike.

DanB

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2012, 07:56:30 PM »
Nice bike. That's a steal!

I had a similar issue with my AVL. Things got gunked up in the shutoff valve filter and the carb bowl. If you haven't taken off the carb yet, I'd suggest unscrewing the bowl on the fuel shutoff valve and make sure fuel is flowing into the carb. Then drop the bowl in the carb and give that a quick cleaning.

I don't think this is your issue, but my gas tank cap vent was plugged on my as well. I'd run a couple of minutes and then it would just die until I equalized the pressure (of course, only learned that after many 4 letter words and pushing)
Suppose I were an idiot, and suppose I were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself. ... Mark Twain
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Arizoni

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2012, 10:11:22 PM »
If one has one of those little angular screwdrivers with the ends at 90 degrees to a short section that acts as a handle they should be able to remove the float bowl from the bottom of the carb without totally removing it.

I got to thinking about the start/die that the engine was doing and it is exactly like some of my old carburetored bikes when they got some water in the float bowl.

The fuel would rise in the jet and allow the engine to start.  As soon as it started it would suck the water up into the jet and die.  After it died, the fuel would again float to the top of the water allowing it to start again.

Remove the float bowl and see if I'm right.  It only takes a little water  to do this and it will look like a bubble that moves around under the fuel if you tilt the bowl.

If that does prove to be the problem, no further repair beyond removing the water is needed although I would suggest that you get an in line fuel filter and install it between the fuel tap valve and the float chamber.
 That can help to trap any additional water that might drain down towards the carb.
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2012, 10:46:54 PM »
Did not notice any water but the guy helping pointed out a lil gunk in the bowl and the jet seemed a lil clogged so hopefully that's all it was. I am not sure how to tell what jet size it is but the number we did see was 110 if that means anything to you guys. I have a picture too but heading out to pick up the girlfriend from work so it'll be up in about an hour or so.

I can't thank you guys enough for all the help and info. I really do appreciate it.

boggy

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2012, 11:50:38 PM »
bitphire,
A few notes from my 2007 AVL.

-I use NGK BR8ES gapped to .019.  Your bike gets running so that's not the issue but I've fouled a few on my AVL. Almost every time it won't kick over, it's been the plug. I highly recommend always having a spare when riding.

-I recently ran into an issue where my breather hose was pinched coming out of the catch can. This caused my bike to run like crap at idle and die on throttle.  There are a few hoses coming out of the engine case. They go back into a can onto the left side, below the seat just under where you'd sit.  3 hoses in, and I think 1 out. Might want to make sure none are pinched and all are clear of crap.

-There is a little fuel filter under the petcock. With the fuel off, simply unscrew it and clear the screen.

-I've had major carb issues with a different carb than yours.  One of which is what you are describing where it runs then dies.  In one case, my main jet had unscrewed itself (or I forgot to screw it in tight  ::)).  In another case my float bowl height needed to be adjusted but best to start with clearing out the jets.

-I don't think an old battery is causing your issue but a new one is always good after a few years.  However, I have a sealed one on mine now and I notice no improvement over a regular battery in it holding a charge at all.  Like I said before, if you don't ride these babies a good distance daily to charge them, these AVL e-starts don't really seem to do much more than make some odd sounds.

Good luck. If that bike has 25k on it then it was running great at some point - and for quite a long time!  Probably just some little thing.

Boggy
« Last Edit: November 28, 2012, 11:52:40 PM by boggy »
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bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2012, 12:43:35 AM »
Here is my ToDo list btw :)
Primary Drive Sprockets (Front and Rear)
Primary Drive Chain
Rear Wheel Sprocket
Bike Chain Itself
Front Break Cable
Rear Turn Signal Lens
Headlight

boggy thanks for that info!

bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #26 on: November 29, 2012, 04:56:44 AM »
Sorry, was walking out the door when I did the last post. That is the to do list according to the previous owner and he supplied the majority of the parts.

Just to clarify, the battery was no good (not just old :P)

bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2012, 09:09:57 PM »
Just wanted to post to let you all know that the bike will not start and stay running!! :) It would appear as though that little gunk in the carb/jet was the issue. Thank you all for the help. Now, about the rest of the todo list... not sure how urgent that stuff is so need to talk with the previous owner about it. Break cable and headlight are the only things that need to be done asap.

Arizoni

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2012, 11:03:04 PM »
"...the bike will not start and stay running!!"  ???
I hope the "not" wasn't supposed to be there?

The headlight should be the same as the small automotive headlights that have both the high and low beam that are available at any auto supply store.
These Royal Enfields don't have the most powerful alternators on them so look for a headlight with a low wattage.  My 2011 came with a 35/50w bulb although the Indian AVL manual says it can use a 55/60w 12 volt bulb.

Before replacing the bulb, check to see if the light switch is turned off or to the park position.
If the switch will turn the parking/tail light on and off, some prior owner has removed the bypass jumper. (This is good).  If he/she did, there is a chance that the headlight switch is not turned on to the 'headlight' position.  If the switch doesn't seem to do anything, the "jumper" may still be installed.  If it is, when you remove the headlight for replacement you might look to see if there is a wiring bundle with a connector that plugs into a short bundle which plugs into another connector.
The UCE bikes use this method of bypassing the light switch to meet DOT requirements in the US.
By removing the short plugged in section and then connecting the connectors that remain behind, suddenly the light switch will start working.
I'm not sure if the AVL is the same as the UCE but I would bet it is.

As for the rear sprocket, if the teeth aren't chipped or bent it is probably okay.
The rear drive chain is probably the crappy Indian product that all of us have found to be very poor and easily worn out. 
With the bike on the center stand the rear chain should move up and down about 2-2 3/8".
Jim
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1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

tooseevee

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2012, 09:17:36 PM »
"...the bike will not start and stay running!!"  ???
I hope the "not" wasn't supposed to be there?

Before replacing the bulb, check to see if the light switch is turned off or to the park position.
If the switch will turn the parking/tail light on and off, some prior owner has removed the bypass jumper. (This is good).  If he/she did, there is a chance that the headlight switch is not turned on to the 'headlight' position.  If the switch doesn't seem to do anything, the "jumper" may still be installed.  If it is, when you remove the headlight for replacement you might look to see if there is a wiring bundle with a connector that plugs into a short bundle which plugs into another connector.

By removing the short plugged in section and then connecting the connectors that remain behind, suddenly the light switch will start working.
I'm not sure if the AVL is the same as the UCE but I would bet it is.


            Yes, the AVL has the jumper. Find it, remove it, plug the two ends together & the switch will then work. Check ALL the lights while you have the headlight out. There are a lot of little ground plugs in there that come loose easily.

              That 110 jet you mentioned is the stock Main Jet. The stock Pilot Jet should be a #15.

              Glad you got it running. I figured you would  :)
2008 ACE Head AVL Classic
1977 Shovelhead Hardtail Bobber

barenekd

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #30 on: November 30, 2012, 11:54:48 PM »
If the main jet was clogged, you can bet the idle circuitry is clogged, too. You need to pull the carb off and get some carb cleaner and soak it for awhile. Then before you put it together you will see some tiny holes in the carb throat behind the needle and slide. Make sure these are clear, use a very small wire to clean them. I use a single strand of electrical wire to stick in them. Also some carbs have a tiny hole behind the mixture screw that will need a poke from the same wire. (Remove the screw and poke the wire into the hole.) Be careful not to hog out these holes.
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bitphire

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Re: 2008 500cc Electra X Classic Valve Adjustment
« Reply #31 on: December 02, 2012, 04:38:21 AM »
Sorry for the long delay on the post. Wednesday I got a call about a 1999 Suzuki Intruder 1400 for $1000. I now own this bike as well, lol. It needs a little work but it does start and run! That's for another forum I would guess though, just need to find a good one like this one.

Quote
...the bike will not start and stay running!!
I hope the "not" wasn't supposed to be there?

You are correct, the NOT was a typo. It does start and run fine. I took it for a spin around the block without much trouble. I haven't had the time to mess with the bike but will check on those teeth and the headlight stuff you guys mentioned when I can. The Intruder has moved to the top of the fix list since it will be my main transportation while the Royal Enfield is waiting on my girlfriend to take the riding course and get her M endorsement.

I will keep posting any updates I have though when I do work on her bike!