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Author Topic: Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears  (Read 675 times)

bitphire

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Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears
« on: April 26, 2013, 03:31:02 PM »
2008 RE se 500 military

Girlfriends dad decided he wanted to try to fix the electric start since he wasn't able to kick start the bike. I am guessing the previous removed the gears because the solenoid wasn't working but not 100%. He pulled it all apart, put the gears in and put all back together. The solenoid is still bad but before we could tap it and get the starter to spin (no gears). Now when he taps it nothing happens (with gears). So I was going to kick start it to make sure it was still in running condition but I can't get it to start. Had no issue's before. It's also a LOT harder to kick with the added gears and the starter makes a whining noise every time I kick it over.

Did he put something in backwards? It seemed like it almost wanted to start once but haven't been able to get close since. He now has left back home to Lubbock, TX (about 6-8 hours away) so I am stuck with figuring this out and I did pay semi attention to what he was doing so I have an idea if I need to swap something around.

Thank you all for any ideas on the issue.

barenekd

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Re: Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2013, 05:53:44 PM »
It is probably a low battery that doesn't have the juice to spin the starter under load. IT doesn't take much to turn it when its free but the starter takes a lot of juice when it's trying to turn the engine over. It's apparent the starter works, so I'd be looking at the battery first. If the starter is turning with the sprag clutch installed, the sprag could be bad. Is it the one that came out of the bike, or did you get a new one? It's not the most reliable contraption in the world. If the rollers are slipping, you will get the results you're having.
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Arizoni

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Re: Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2013, 10:13:07 PM »
bitphire
If the starter sprag clutch is installed correctly and it is not defective it should be slipping when you try to kick start the engine.
If it is slipping, the electric starter won't be turning so it won't make a noise.

Of course it's always possible the gear train that connects the sprag clutch to the starter has a problem and is making noise but that wouldn't sound like the starter motor was turning while you were kicking it.

I haven't seen the sprag clutch in a AVL but it is possible to install the sprags backwards.
If that happened the clutch would lock up and drive the starter motor whenever the engine was turned in the direction it normally runs.

I suggest removing the side cover and anything that is covering the ES gear train.
Then, rotate the engines crankshaft in a counterclockwise direction (looking from the left side of the bike).
If rotating the crankshaft is turning the ES gears, the sprag clutch is installed backwards.
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

Ice

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Re: Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2013, 05:00:25 AM »
2008 RE se 500 military

Girlfriends dad decided he wanted to try to fix the electric start since he wasn't able to kick start the bike. I am guessing the previous removed the gears because the solenoid wasn't working but not 100%. He pulled it all apart, put the gears in and put all back together. The solenoid is still bad but before we could tap it and get the starter to spin (no gears). Now when he taps it nothing happens (with gears). So I was going to kick start it to make sure it was still in running condition but I can't get it to start. Had no issue's before. It's also a LOT harder to kick with the added gears and the starter makes a whining noise every time I kick it over.

Did he put something in backwards? It seemed like it almost wanted to start once but haven't been able to get close since. He now has left back home to Lubbock, TX (about 6-8 hours away) so I am stuck with figuring this out and I did pay semi attention to what he was doing so I have an idea if I need to swap something around.

Thank you all for any ideas on the issue.

Not supposed to do that.
Yes it is possible to install the sprag backwards.
I can break it better,,,,at night, in the rain, on the trail,, 20 miles from nowhere.

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bitphire

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Re: Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2013, 02:26:49 PM »
Just wanted to pop in and say thank you for the info. I haven't had the chance to get in there yet but I would bet it was installed backwards. I don't know if it's the stock one or a new one as we just got the bike back in November and been doing small work on it. Just to be clear about the sound, it's like your pushing RC toy car instead of using the remote to drive it. It does it on every kick (haven't kicked it since I posted about it just incase something was wrong didn't want to make it worse)

Again thank you! I will update this once I have had the time to open it up and take a look.

High On Octane

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Re: Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2013, 05:27:20 PM »
Just to be clear about the sound, it's like your pushing RC toy car instead of using the remote to drive it. It does it on every kick (haven't kicked it since I posted about it just incase something was wrong didn't want to make it worse)

Something was definitely installed wrong or something is not working.  The starter motor shouldn't be turning while your kicking the bike over.  That might be why it won't start, the starter motor is absorbing all the kicking energy before it has a chance to turn the motor fast enough to fire.  I'd get your hands on the repair manual and tear it back apart and see what's up in there.  Maybe try kick starting the bike with the start removed and see if you can get it to fire.

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Arizoni

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Re: Can't Kick Start After Adding Electric Starter Gears
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2013, 06:54:41 PM »
If the sound is the starter motor spinning when the kickstarter is being moved, it's a good thing the engine didn't start.

Had it started, it would have overspeeded the motor and thrown the armature wires, totally ruining the ES.
Jim
2011 G5 Deluxe
1999 Miata 10th Anniversary