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Author Topic: 500 cc Harley  (Read 4368 times)

mgm

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500 cc Harley
« on: November 07, 2013, 04:08:27 PM »
http://blogs.wsj.com/speakeasy/2013/11/04/harley-davidson-unveils-new-smaller-bikes-for-urban-riders/

http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-mo-autos-harley-davidson-street-500-street-750-20131101,0,443022.story#axzz2jyZWLpMc

500 cc, liquid cooled, less than $7,000. Several other articles mentioned the fact the this series would be produced in India as well as the US. Looks like they want play in the US entry level market as well as take on Enfield on their home turf.

Joel-in-dallas

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2013, 05:04:50 PM »
They want the high end of the Indian market. But right now the tariffs are such that if the bike isn't fully made in India it will be very very expensive.

Right now with tariffs the Harley Davidson XL883 (883 low) costs 5.71 to 7.71 lakh (Indian currency). The Vrod costs  19.86 to 19.86 lakh.

For comparison the Royal Enfield Thunderbird 500 costs 1.25 to 1.59 lakh and the Royal Enfield Classic 500 (called the c5 in the us) costs 1.15 to 1.56 lakh. The continental will cost almost 2.00 lakh.

So if Harley Davidson can drop to a price point of 2.5 to 4.0 lakh they could be the top end of the market. The problem is that their motorcycles are at least 3 to 4 times as expensive with the tariffs. Also, their bikes are seen as too big and until the Street 500 and Street 750 that was probably true. Harley needs to move more units and needs growth outside the United States.

Also, Harley is reaching the end of its fewer but much more expensive motorcycle strategy. They need new riders and they need to increase the number of motorcycles as well. They need to move beyond middle aged men in the US.


Ducati Scotty

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2013, 05:47:42 PM »
I'm glad to see HD do something different, and take ownership of it.  Their last beginner bike was the Buell Blast.  Note that it was a Buell, not an HD.  And it served its purpose well.  If you bought one you could trade it in a year later and get credit for the full purchase price on a new Harley.  So it was their gateway drug to get people into motorcycling. 

That said, it was kind of a turd and fairly uninspiring to ride or even look at.  And it sounded like an anemic lawn mower with a cough.  So to see HD bring out a small, inexpensive bike that has both their name and their style is a breath of fresh air.

Scott

Joel-in-dallas

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2013, 05:55:38 PM »
I think Harley is going to be surprised how much it sells. Its something different. If they don't tune it down, it is quite possible that the Street 750 since its 200 pounds lighter and liquid cooled and can get higher revs could outperform the Iron 883. It looks like it would be a better bike in the curves anyway.

I think it is the most exciting motorcycle from Harley Davidson in some time. I think it might sell very well. For the crowd that says the sportster isnt a real harley, they will hate the Street 500 & 750

D the D

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2013, 08:02:31 PM »
I think Harley is going to be surprised how much it sells. Its something different. If they don't tune it down, it is quite possible that the Street 750 since its 200 pounds lighter and liquid cooled and can get higher revs could outperform the Iron 883. It looks like it would be a better bike in the curves anyway.

I think it is the most exciting motorcycle from Harley Davidson in some time. I think it might sell very well. For the crowd that says the sportster isnt a real harley, they will hate the Street 500 & 750

Nicely said!
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REpozer

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2013, 10:29:15 PM »
Pretty obvious H-D is trying to make some marketing changes.
They don't have the young generation in their pockets,. yet.
Would be nice to see something other than the cookie cutter clone, middle age , fat , bald, with a go-tee in a pirate costume riding a H-D.
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Ducati Scotty

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2013, 10:54:42 PM »
Would be nice to see something other than the cookie cutter clone, middle age , fat , bald, with a go-tee in a pirate costume riding a H-D.

Nicely said!

tooseevee

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2013, 11:19:46 PM »
Pretty obvious H-D is trying to make some marketing changes.
They don't have the young generation in their pockets,. yet.
Would be nice to see something other than the cookie cutter clone, middle age , fat , bald, with a go-tee in a pirate costume riding a H-D.

        Hey, hey   ;D I'm not middle-aged ,, I'm a genuine dinosaur   ;)

         PS: I've watched the clowns come & go for 50 years. The real travesty is what those clowns at OCC, TLC & the Discovery Channel started back in 2008. And the newly divorced, Just For Men doused & well Viagraed, intercommed, steroed, HD Chinese-leather-clad lotharios on blindingly Chinese chromed out "factory custom" garbage barges trying to pick up 20 year olds were the funniest. And they're also why the market is flooded with very reasonable used harleys that people who might buy new ones are buying instead. Most of these instant credit card "bikers" lasted about two years. Many of them killed themselves their first season & some on their first ride.

     I hope h-d's new small bike experiment is successful. Their past attempts haven't been. And it's what bankrupted Indian. They tried to compete in the small bike market for too long & it wasn't what Americans wanted. 
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Ducati Scotty

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2013, 11:28:22 PM »
I hear you on what America wants.  What about Europe?  Would a smaller HD work there?  Or do Europeans who want HDs want them big?

Scott

Gypsyjon

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2013, 12:12:01 AM »
From what I have read about them, HD recognizes India is a HUGE motorcycle market and they do not have anything that fits that region. This is their first run at getting a slice.

Also, at this point it is not clear, at least to me if they will be bringing them to the states anytime soon. I do have to say, a water cooled 500 or 750 twin sounds like lots of fun.

I rod a V Rod once, which of course is a totally different animal, but when I got back on my some what souped up twin cam Roadking, welll....it felt a bit anemic....
I've gone back to my roots. British 1 lunger, stump puller.

Ducati Scotty

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2013, 12:17:55 AM »
Interesting.  Maybe it's just for India then and they'll never release it in the US.  Certainly makes sense to try to get a slice of the pie in India, and if they don't release it in the US then they're not diluting their brand here in any way.

Scott

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2013, 01:01:17 AM »
Harley is already assembling knock down kits of the 883 in India in a couple of different styles.
It's popular with the people who can afford it.

For most, it's priced way out of any reasonable budget for most of them and even those who can afford them are griping about the cost of accessories.
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Craig McClure

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2013, 02:43:27 AM »
I'll be curious to hear about performance. Ducati 750 twins are very zippy. If Harley comes close it may be interesting. I did notice it was fairly HEAVY. Real original Triumph 750's were under 400lb. I think the baby Harleys need taller skinny wheels & more rearward pegs, & flatter bars. Might be cheaper to just buy something else, perhaps some older technology....like to see Enfield re-engineer & offer A VINCENT BLACK SHADOW facsimile . That'd show em!
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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2013, 07:29:46 PM »
They're being assembled in India and brought to the US.  The US HD website is touting them right now, but they won't be available until 2014.  This is going to pose a challenge to both RE and Triumph, because the 500cc engine only costs 6800 (just about where a C5 military rests) and it is well under anything Triumph offers.  That being said, the Honda 500 is cheaper still and I wouldn't compare either of the aforementioned brands to one of those little plastic toys.  I looked at the pictures and I hope they're successful, but if they aren't built in America, I can't see myself riding one.  If it comes from India the only two letters I need to know are RE!
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Ducati Scotty

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Re: 500 cc Harley
« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2013, 07:42:51 PM »
I see these as very different styles of bikes.  The HD is an HD and looks like one.  That doesn't put it in the same niche as RE, Triumph, or the new Honda 500s.  I think most buyers would see them as more different than similar.  It could muscle in on the smaller cruisers out there, like the V-Star 650 or other 800cc cruisers.

Scott