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Author Topic: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread  (Read 7999 times)

tooseevee

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #195 on: June 05, 2014, 11:55:26 AM »
It's the other valve that might have the issue

            Yes, of course, I know that. Brain fart & I'm physically at the end of a multitude of ropes & I'm just trying to maintain. I know full well the intake is the larger.
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tooseevee

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #196 on: June 05, 2014, 12:00:59 PM »
A trick I use is to get the piston within about 1/2" of TDC compression - but not at the top to eliminate possible valve damage - and use something like a tyre lever or any other suitable means to lever the rocker arm to open the valve a little and slip the pushrod end in while the pushrod end of the rocker is raised, giving more space. It is a fiddly job and the fuel tank has to be removed for access, but it works with less faffing around than lifting the cylinder head  ;)
 B.W.

           My head was already loose & no way could I pry on the rocker without the head tight to the cylinder & anyway not alone with only two hands which don't work. I see what you're saying (& have even talked about it here before), but I would need another set of hands which I don't have. Doesn't anybody think I think this shit out before I do it?
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tooseevee

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #197 on: June 05, 2014, 12:35:13 PM »
I guess I don't understand why the crank couldn't be set so the piston is at TDC on the firing stroke and then the pushrods installed by removing the rocker arms?   :-\

Seems like if the tappets were at their lowest position and both valves were closed removing the rocker arms would allow the push rods to be installed fairly easily?   After they were in place it should be a no brainer to reinstall the rocker arms, caps and bolts.

Maybe it's that funky compression release that's causing the issue?  :o

Never mind.   I forgot the AVL has those shafts going thru the rocker arms and was thinking about the old Iron Barrel and the UCE designs where there is a removable cap on the rocker arms.  :-[ :-[

            I'm sorry. I'm outa here until the engine is finished & running. I want to thank everyone who's helped, including you, Arizoni, no offense, but it's distracting & of no use to me to be second-guessed at every move. Sometimes by folks who have no clue or don't read the whole thread or have never done the details. I'm alone here, I have no dealer close, I have few options if I fuck up & I DO know what I'm doing & I'm slow & methodical & careful because I HAVE to be because I'm in some physical pain all the time & that in itself makes it more difficult & maybe I HAVE bit off more than I should have this time but I've overcome way more worser things than this in my life.

            Again. I mean no offense to anyone. I'm just gonna avoid the teeny details of this job from now on. A lot of it is just distracting & too much time on this ACER thing is also VERY hard on my neck which I need to finish my bike. A half hour on this thing & I can't move my neck for an hour.       
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Chuck D

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #198 on: June 05, 2014, 12:58:18 PM »
            I'm sorry. I'm outa here until the engine is finished & running. I want to thank everyone who's helped, including you, Arizoni, no offense, but it's distracting & of no use to me to be second-guessed at every move. Sometimes by folks who have no clue or don't read the whole thread or have never done the details. I'm alone here, I have no dealer close, I have few options if I fuck up & I DO know what I'm doing & I'm slow & methodical & careful because I HAVE to be because I'm in some physical pain all the time & that in itself makes it more difficult & maybe I HAVE bit off more than I should have this time but I've overcome way more worser things than this in my life.

            Again. I mean no offense to anyone. I'm just gonna avoid the teeny details of this job from now on. A lot of it is just distracting & too much time on this ACER thing is also VERY hard on my neck which I need to finish my bike. A half hour on this thing & I can't move my neck for an hour.     
Was that an invitation? ;D
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ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #199 on: June 05, 2014, 01:19:21 PM »
Just take it easy, and do a step at a time.
We can wait.

If you have a question, just email me.
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Arizoni

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #200 on: June 05, 2014, 06:50:10 PM »
tooseevee
My apologies for bothering you.
Jim
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REpozer

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #201 on: June 05, 2014, 09:38:24 PM »
Me too. Sorry.
I'm not a leader in Inovative Bullet AVL Technollogy (IBAT)

So I am here to help:
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DanB

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #202 on: June 06, 2014, 02:10:36 AM »
Good luck 2CV!!  Kick that things ass!
Suppose I were an idiot, and suppose I were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself. ... Mark Twain
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Arizoni

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #203 on: June 06, 2014, 05:25:14 AM »
For what it's worth, I just read the AVL Repair Manuals description of how to change/install the push rods.

It says one removes the rocker arms by pulling the 2 pins they rotate on, then remove the rockers (being careful not to have the thrust washers fall down inside the engine) and then pull the push rods out.

Maybe doing it this way would make installing the shrouded push rods easier than the method 2CV used?

Just a thought.  :)
Jim
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1999 Miata 10th Anniversary

ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #204 on: June 06, 2014, 08:45:48 PM »
For what it's worth, I just read the AVL Repair Manuals description of how to change/install the push rods.

It says one removes the rocker arms by pulling the 2 pins they rotate on, then remove the rockers (being careful not to have the thrust washers fall down inside the engine) and then pull the push rods out.

Maybe doing it this way would make installing the shrouded push rods easier than the method 2CV used?

Just a thought.  :)
That's the way I did it when I had the head here. It is a bit of a pain in the ass to fiddle with the thrust washers. But it works.
He had to take the head off again anyway because I was having him do a valve-to-piston clearance check anyway, wit clay on the piston crown and rotating past TDC on overlap.
Turns out that was a smart move, because this big valve arrangement just barely has enough valve clearance now. But it does make it safely with enough safety margin room so it won't hit.
This was a big chore for him to do, but I insisted on it to protect the new valves from potential damage if it didn't clear.
In the end, it turned out that all was well, but it was close.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

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High On Octane

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #205 on: June 06, 2014, 11:05:39 PM »
That's the way I did it when I had the head here. It is a bit of a pain in the ass to fiddle with the thrust washers. But it works.
He had to take the head off again anyway because I was having him do a valve-to-piston clearance check anyway, wit clay on the piston crown and rotating past TDC on overlap.
Turns out that was a smart move, because this big valve arrangement just barely has enough valve clearance now. But it does make it safely with enough safety margin room so it won't hit.
This was a big chore for him to do, but I insisted on it to protect the new valves from potential damage if it didn't clear.
In the end, it turned out that all was well, but it was close.

I feel like I am definitely going to need to do this when I assemble the twin......
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ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #206 on: June 06, 2014, 11:32:45 PM »
I feel like I am definitely going to need to do this when I assemble the twin......
You will need to.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

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Adrian

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #207 on: June 07, 2014, 03:15:07 PM »
The factory inlet valve can just foul the piston if you start swapping cams, so they must be running the clearances pretty tight even with the stock AVL cam. But if there is any evidence of slight valve to piston crown contact (apart from the loud CLANK when you first try and turn the engine over), you at least know where to cut a shallow pocket for the valve!

Refitting the sprung thrust washers is a right royal a pain, I used to hate that job more than the tappet adjustment until I found out I could use the handle on my larger tap wrench to guide everything into line for refitting the rocker shafts. A spare rocker shaft ground to a taper at one end would also do. Or speak nicely to a friend with a lathe and some spare steel bar. Don't struggle.

A.

tooseevee

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #208 on: June 07, 2014, 09:05:12 PM »
     Just for info for you guys: the pushrods with the stock adjusters install super easy if screwed in to the shortest if you haven't torqued down the head yet & it's just sitting loose on the head gasket. And of course, you're at TDC compression & the lifters are all the way down. Once you get the rod in its rocker socket & the adjuster located over the lifter, it's a simple matter to turn the adjuster down with fingers just far enough so the pushrod ball end can't fall out of its rocker socket. Leave Them Very Loose 8)   

            Now torque your head down in stages checking once in a while to see that the push rods are still loose. With the head torqued to its final 20, adjust your push rods per usual. This worked out VERY easy for me & if it seemed easy for me ANYbody can do it   :) ;)

             If I EVER try those shrouded adjusters again down the road, I will have 20 or 30 thousandths taken off of the bottom surface of the shroud. They are just plain too long to deal with alone & they are just plain too long; They add 3/16" to the overall length of each rod. They just might fit over the lifters without all the drama if shortened up a bit & they would still do their job.

             I'll never rev this engine high enough to need shrouded push rods anyway  ;D   :) :) Who am *I* kidding?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2014, 11:56:19 PM by tooseevee »
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azcatfan

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #209 on: June 07, 2014, 09:18:08 PM »
Congrats 2CV, can't wait for you to experience the finished product! :D
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