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Author Topic: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread  (Read 5535 times)

ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2014, 03:49:29 PM »
You sure have your work cut out for you right now Ace!  Between taking on 2CVs AVL AND my twin heads, you must be really crunching some new numbers you haven't had to deal with before.  But I can't think of anyone else that could possibly work the magic better than you can.  :)  I really hope those Big head rockers will fit the AVL.  That'd be sick!

Scottie

Yes, it's been arduous for a while, because every different kind of head that came in the door needed a new development project, and it was killing us with R&D work.
But now, we have some of them under our belt already, and it would be nice if we could use some of our already developed stuff on these other heads coming in.

Of course, Scottie, YOUR heads are the "oddball" heads that need another whole new development project. Sheesh!! 8) 8) 8)
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head Conversion. Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available anywhere.  AVL mods available. UCE kit coming.

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ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2014, 12:59:36 PM »
It has come to my attention via "the grapevine" that our Ace Magnum Cams have been successfully used in an AVL engine. I knew this could be done, but I didn't know if it would solve the valve bounce issue that is present with the stock cams, so I didn't try to pursue that.
I still don't know for sure, because the person who tried them didn't really know that there was a valve bounce issue, so maybe he doesn't rev it up much.
But, it could give some added lift to the AVL Engine which the AVL desperately needs. It's not a huge amount of lift increase, but it's the same as the Fireball,  and it dropped right into the AVL with no other changes needed except for lengthening the pushrods and removing the valve lifter thing, just like the 'S cams' need.
So, details are slim, but we do know that they drop in and give added lift and performance increase. We don't know for sure if the valve bounce still happens, but the person reporting says he doesn't notice any.

Like I said, I have avoided pushing these for AVL use before, but I got this report from somebody who tried it, so I'm passing the info along to anyone who might be interested.

Please do not construe this to be any attempt to horn-in on the S Cams from Bullet Whisperer. We are tight with B.W., and we wouldn't do that. And the S Cams have had much more conclusive testing done on them.
I really only mention it as a relatively easy way to get some more lift in the AVL.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2014, 04:00:53 PM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head Conversion. Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available anywhere.  AVL mods available. UCE kit coming.

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armando_chavez

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2014, 07:21:09 PM »
Wow this is great news considering BW has said he will no longer offer the S cams.  i would really like to see some more tests done. unfortunately i dont have to $ to do it at the moment.

Bullet Whisperer

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2014, 08:56:06 PM »
Wow this is great news considering BW has said he will no longer offer the S cams.  i would really like to see some more tests done. unfortunately i dont have to $ to do it at the moment.
Never say never ! - there are a good number of these in use now, both in the U.K and overseas. It seemed a load of hassle for some to get money to me, but recently, better options have worked with less trouble. That said, they are not cheap and can take a long time to arrive here after I order a batch to be made. I could live just as easily without them - I certainly wouldn't get rich out of doing them, but I've enjoyed others telling me they do for their machines just as they did for my test machine when I first tried them  ;)
 B.W.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2014, 08:59:40 PM by Bullet Whisperer »

ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2014, 09:39:36 PM »
I would prefer that the S Cams be considered the main choice for AVL owners. We would recommend spring changes and other changes when attempting to deploy any of our cams.

Having a happy working relationship with B.W. is much more important to us than moving a few sets of cams.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head Conversion. Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available anywhere.  AVL mods available. UCE kit coming.

Please visit my new website:
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High On Octane

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2014, 10:36:00 PM »
+2 to what Ace and BW both said.
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armando_chavez

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2014, 10:59:58 PM »
i wouldnt mind paying a little extra in a while, if there is easier ways to pay.  especially since the S cams are already very reputable.

armando_chavez

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2014, 11:06:20 PM »
I would also love seeing the big head roller rockers on my AVL head.  I feel like i might be the youngest guy on this forum, and i dont want to be judged when i say i would like the fastest avl haha.

Adrian

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2014, 04:25:45 PM »
The fastest 500 AVL is probably Basanti's track bike in India, he has done the squish band modification and various racing mods as well as the S cams. Perhaps if there IS enough demand for another batch of cams in the US, BW could market them through Ace, rather then send lots of individual sets over the Atlantic.

One more concern on the technical front, for a seriously thrashed engine I would want to replace the cam followers (and guides) on the AVL engine with the much more robust items from the C.I. engine, ideally the Samarat thicker stem version with the hard chromed feet and bronze guides. I have had a set of the AVL cam followers fail (the foot snaps off and bounces around in the timing cover looking for other things to damage) as they are not really up to the job.  >:(  With the stock rockers this needs the push rods extending by approximately 3/8", but as you would be using custom push rods this should not bother you too much!

Have fun, guys!  :)

A.

ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2014, 04:35:48 PM »
Some good suggestions there, Adrian.
Thanks!

On the subject of Tooseevee ' s head, it is at Mondello's awaiting a flow test and some quotes on 2 different types of mods based on different budgets.
I don't know yet exactly how far Tooseevee wants to go with this thing, so I will offer some options.

However, they will be evaluating the use of our roller rocker kit on the AVL head, so that we will know if it is viable, or if it would need some changes. So we will get that information out of this process.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2014, 04:39:03 PM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head Conversion. Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available anywhere.  AVL mods available. UCE kit coming.

Please visit my new website:
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Bill Harris

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #25 on: January 22, 2014, 05:42:34 PM »
I too, have had a cam follower fail in the Harris Scrambler.  This is one of the weak points in the AVL engine and needs some attention.

Cheers,
Bill

Adrian

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2014, 02:33:11 PM »
My guess is that the factory wanted to shed some weight in the valve train, not such a good idea.  I should have specified the 3/8" figure was for my project bike with S cams and modded C.I. crankcases, other engines may differ!

A.


dampking

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #27 on: January 23, 2014, 03:32:07 PM »
The fastest 500 AVL is probably Basanti's track bike in India, he has done the squish band modification and various racing mods as well as the S cams. Perhaps if there IS enough demand for another batch of cams in the US, BW could market them through Ace, rather then send lots of individual sets over the Atlantic.

One more concern on the technical front, for a seriously thrashed engine I would want to replace the cam followers (and guides) on the AVL engine with the much more robust items from the C.I. engine, ideally the Samarat thicker stem version with the hard chromed feet and bronze guides. I have had a set of the AVL cam followers fail (the foot snaps off and bounces around in the timing cover looking for other things to damage) as they are not really up to the job.  >:(  With the stock rockers this needs the push rods extending by approximately 3/8", but as you would be using custom push rods this should not bother you too much!

Have fun, guys!  :)

A.

I still think BW's AVL was faster because I never saw Basanti posting speed specs higher than 150kph.

tooseevee

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #28 on: January 23, 2014, 06:27:26 PM »
Ace,

        Not rushing you at all on the other ideas, but are you going to recommend the TM-32 as a carb choice?

        I can still get one for 127 free shipping. I'll order it soon before that offer goes away if you approve.

         Plus I want to set it on my coffee table & stare at it while visions of warm weather, a running engine & thumping drum in my head   :)   ;)

          PS: It's F-ing freezing here. Got to run the Husquevarna snow blower twice this week.
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ace.cafe

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Re: Tooseevee's AVL upgrade thread
« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2014, 06:40:49 PM »
Ace,

        Not rushing you at all on the other ideas, but are you going to recommend the TM-32 as a carb choice?

        I can still get one for 127 free shipping. I'll order it soon before that offer goes away if you approve.

         Plus I want to set it on my coffee table & stare at it while visions of warm weather, a running engine & thumping drum in my head   :)   ;)

          PS: It's F-ing freezing here. Got to run the Husquevarna snow blower twice this week.

If you are satisfied that a peak power rpm of  6000 rpm is okay for you, then the TM32 will do fine. You only need the TM34 if the desired rpms are higher than 6000 rpm. They will both fit the manifold, so you can pick the one you want, based on your needs.
And as the rpm requirements go higher, even larger carbs can be needed.
It depends on your desires.

I need to know which one you pick, so we can port the head to suit.
This means filling the port floor up with some filler, so that it can be made smaller for this application. The port size as it comes from the factory is too big for normal purposes. A smaller port diameter will help your midrange torque and cruising power, which seems to be what you are wanting, right?
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head Conversion. Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available anywhere.  AVL mods available. UCE kit coming.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/