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Author Topic: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions  (Read 6647 times)

PaulF

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For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« on: October 02, 2008, 03:19:29 PM »
Kevin,

I'm probably going to piss off a few people but let me make two statements.

My opinion, after viewing the pics, is that the UCE motor is an abomination. It goes against everything I bought my Bullet for and purists know exactly what I mean, so there's no need for me to elaborate. I also think its kind of foolish to use technology like fuel injection and retain ancient solid tappets. I can spend a tad more money and by a Japper that will smoke it all day long and have a bigger dealer and parts network. I had foregone all those considerations and plunked down my money, instead, for an RE, because the Bullet is a Bullet and there is no other like it - until it becomes a UJM lookalike.

HOWEVER, if the factory shrank the UCE bore, made it a twin and printed "750 INTERCEPTOR" on the side covers, with reproduction Smith gauges, ammeter in the headlight nacelle, and pea shooter silencers, dripping with chrome,  I WOULD BUY ONE TOMORROW and I think they would fly off the shelves as it were.

So, with RE seemingly undergoing this rapid evolution, first the AVL, now the UCE, has there been any talk of a twin? The US market could use it.

Thanks
Paul
« Last Edit: October 02, 2008, 03:23:27 PM by PaulF »

t120rbullet

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2008, 03:52:05 PM »
The UCE has hydraulic lifters.
It sounds and runs just like the older ones and the sound is where the market is in India.

95% of RE's market is India and a twin would be a failure there.
I don't think they will ever make a twin until their home market calls for it.
As far as a Jap bike smoking it I don't think India will care, it's the sound that sells them there.
1999 Enfield 500 Black Deluxe "Silver"
2012 Concours 14 (no name yet)
2013 Royal Star Venture S  "Jelly Roll"

PaulF

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2008, 03:58:58 PM »
Well, then it's a moot point.

Nevermind.

StL_Stadtroller

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2008, 04:10:08 PM »
Personally, I'll stand by my previous opinion, and confirmed by my test ride of the shop UCE bike this past weekend:
The UCE setup will be an awesome bike on it's own merits.  However,
I feel that it should *not* be called a "Bullet".

it's a totally new bike. Let's not tarnish the name of the old, and hold back the reputation of the new with the Bullet name.
Brian Wittling, St. Louis, MO
Her Majesty's Own Royal Enfield Motoring Enthusiast Society
Member Emeritus

Eamon

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2008, 06:02:34 PM »
Personally, I'll stand by my previous opinion, and confirmed by my test ride of the shop UCE bike this past weekend:
The UCE setup will be an awesome bike on it's own merits.  However,
I feel that it should *not* be called a "Bullet".

it's a totally new bike. Let's not tarnish the name of the old, and hold back the reputation of the new with the Bullet name.

Naturally, we are all entitled to our opinions, but I think they'd be foolish NOT to call it a Bullet.  The name Bullet is wrapped up in their name/brand recognition.  I think that as long as the basic platform looks like a Bullet, it has a long stroke single in the 350-500 cc range, and has the sound, then it should be called a Bullet.   :)

Eamon
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http://www.sterlingloons.com

Eamon

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2008, 06:28:36 PM »
Kevin,

I'm probably going to piss off a few people but let me make two statements.

My opinion, after viewing the pics, is that the UCE motor is an abomination.....
.......................
HOWEVER, if the factory shrank the UCE bore, made it a twin and printed "750 INTERCEPTOR" on the side covers, with reproduction Smith gauges, ammeter in the headlight nacelle, and pea shooter silencers, dripping with chrome,  I WOULD BUY ONE TOMORROW and I think they would fly off the shelves as it were.
???
I'm not at all pissed off, but I don't understand your vitriol about the new UCE Bullet engine being an abomination when you follow it with your second statement.  By your own reasoning, why wouldn't the new Interceptor also be an abomination?  Besides, you've already got a classic Bullet - no one's taking it away from you just because they came up with a more modern motor.

Eamon
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http://www.sterlingloons.com

StL_Stadtroller

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2008, 07:11:48 PM »
Personally, I'll stand by my previous opinion, and confirmed by my test ride of the shop UCE bike this past weekend:
The UCE setup will be an awesome bike on it's own merits.  However,
I feel that it should *not* be called a "Bullet".

it's a totally new bike. Let's not tarnish the name of the old, and hold back the reputation of the new with the Bullet name.

Naturally, we are all entitled to our opinions, but I think they'd be foolish NOT to call it a Bullet.  The name Bullet is wrapped up in their name/brand recognition. 

Precisely.  Recognition wich to the masses - is an impression of an old, tinkery, noisy, leaky, unreliable copy of a British marque.
The new UCE is none of the above. So why label it with the name of something generally recognised as such?

Now is the time for RE/Eicher to turn a new page in brand reputation and recognition in North America!
Brian Wittling, St. Louis, MO
Her Majesty's Own Royal Enfield Motoring Enthusiast Society
Member Emeritus

Jon

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2008, 07:40:07 PM »
Lets have a quick look at the history of the Bullet. It began as a range of three
models in the 1930's, sporting 250,350 and 500 singles. Post-war the name
was used on a 350 single from 1949 which shared similar design elements but
was by no means identical to the pre-war bikes,this is the model that spawned
the Indian Bullet,it was joined by a 500 in 1952.This could be termed the first
re-design. The next major change was in 1956 when the Bullet got a new
chassis and a bit more power, second redesign. A really major change for
1962 when the UNIT Bullet arrived based on the 250 Crusader,third redesign.
Then we have the AVL fourth redesign and now the UCE the latest redesign.

My question to the originator of the thread is which one is the "REAL" Bullet?
Singling (no pun intended) one particular model out as a favourite is fine as is
voicing ones opinion but I would like to know what a "purist" is and what they know
that the rest of us don't.?

Critiscising Enfield for using the time honoured name is like criticising Ford for
re-using the Mustang name or Chevvy for the Camaro. By this logic even if Enfield
developed a twin based on the UCE they couldn't call it an "Interceptor" because
it wouldn't be the same as a "real" one as defined by the purists amonst us.

Personally I would be quite happy to add any of the Bullet models to my stable
but will probably wait until I can afford a UCE.....unless anyone has a cheap
basket case iron barrel out there!

Regards a definately impure enthusiast

Eamon

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2008, 07:43:38 PM »
Personally, I'll stand by my previous opinion, and confirmed by my test ride of the shop UCE bike this past weekend:
The UCE setup will be an awesome bike on it's own merits.  However,
I feel that it should *not* be called a "Bullet".

it's a totally new bike. Let's not tarnish the name of the old, and hold back the reputation of the new with the Bullet name.

Naturally, we are all entitled to our opinions, but I think they'd be foolish NOT to call it a Bullet.  The name Bullet is wrapped up in their name/brand recognition. 

Precisely.  Recognition wich to the masses - is an impression of an old, tinkery, noisy, leaky, unreliable copy of a British marque.
The new UCE is none of the above. So why label it with the name of something generally recognised as such?

Now is the time for RE/Eicher to turn a new page in brand reputation and recognition in North America!

I don't agree with the premise that the Bullet name is universally associated with "an old, tinkery, noisy, leaky, unreliable copy of a British marque."  I think it's just as commonly (and maybe more widely, at least in my experience) thought of as simply a classic styled thumper - especially with younger people.  Who knows, though?  I guess time will tell...

Eamon
Eamon in Seattle
2006 Bullet 500 Deluxe
http://www.sterlingloons.com

PhilJ

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2008, 08:46:30 PM »
Thanks Jon,

You saved me a lot of typing, well said. But i was going to use the "Every thiong after the 1954 Corvette wasn't a Corvette" tack.  ::)

HRAB

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #10 on: October 03, 2008, 02:28:41 PM »
They just don't make 'em like they used to!
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Kevin Mahoney

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #11 on: October 03, 2008, 02:47:29 PM »
I think this thread will go back and forth like this for years. I enjoy it both pro and con. For what it is worth, the factory's code name has been the "C-5" and they told me yesterday the new official name is "Bullet Classic 500". This should engender some good conversation. The naming conventions at the factory can be confusing at times (to us, not to them)  and do not always reflect precisely what we call them here. The new bike will definitely be  Bullet like when you see.  Since it is the first totally new product in so many years and REM has put so much into it I would have liked a sexier name, but........

Jon

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2008, 07:55:37 PM »
My personal preference for the name of the UCE would have been Crusader
or Continental as these hark back to unit construction RE singles of yore, not
that Bullet isn't a perfectly acceptable name given it's provenance. If you want
a sexier name ( to be fair the Bullet in general is rather more matronly than
hotty, none the worse for that) you could keep the Bullet geneology and call it
the Fury. For those too young to know the Fury was Enfields attempt to
build a Goldie beater,on a good day it got close but did have a distressing
tendancy to dump it's guts all over the landscape if used hard with the stock
big-end.

luoma

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #13 on: October 03, 2008, 08:54:21 PM »
I think they could keep the Bullet name and still give it another one. Lets look at what we've got now:
Bullet Clasic
Bullet Delux
Bullet Military
Bullet Electra

If the new one had a chrome tank ad upswept pipe, it could be a Bullet Interceptor. ie an Interceptor-type layout on a Bullet platform.

cyrusb

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Re: For Kevin - Assessment and Opinions
« Reply #14 on: October 05, 2008, 02:08:56 AM »
The old iron barreled classics are not copies of classics, they are classics. And I'm glad I was lucky enough to find an 05  kicker. If they want to call those UCE stomach pumps Bullets , so be it, but we know what they are.