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Author Topic: Spark Plug  (Read 8739 times)

Blue Ridge Wheeltor

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #15 on: April 13, 2009, 12:06:36 PM »
Mike in Waynesboro is known to be a good Ural dealer too.
REA #25
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe (Blue)
2006 Ural Patrol
1978 BMW R 100s--SOLD--
1977 HD XLCR
1971 Triumph Bonneville

Kevin Mahoney

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #16 on: April 13, 2009, 01:13:54 PM »
I know Mike personally and will also vouch for him. I am a bit concerned that you haven't addressed the root cause of the plug failures. Any brand of plug even some cheap plug from Communist Red China should last longer than yours are. If it were me, I would do a plug chop test (described in detail elsewhere in the forum - use the search feature) and check your mixture.

UncleErnie

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #17 on: April 13, 2009, 01:26:00 PM »
Hmmm- maybe a bad batch of NGK's?   Anyhoo, I'm never one to argue with success.
Keep us posted after the next 100 miles.
Run what ya brung

RBHoge

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #18 on: April 13, 2009, 09:35:58 PM »
A bad batch of NGK's... I doubt that seriously. The first one came with the bike from India. The next two came from CMW. The last two came from the local Honda dealer. The sources were far to diverse to have been from the same batch. I will not buy another BR8ES NGK plug from any source! :P

I'm not burning any bridges, but the BR8ES plugs have let me down far too often for me to trust them. The iridum plugs could still be an option, but there will be Bosch, Autolite, and several other brands to go through before I would consider NGK again.
1972 Honda CB 450 Rufus, Murdered
1978 Triumph T-140 E, Sadly gone
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe Iron head, " Old Bill"
1971 Honda CB-100,"Kikuchiyo"-traded
O Day 20 Sailboat "Tempus Fugative"
1992 Mazda Miata "Lady Murisaki"250,00miles!
Too many Toys, what else is retirement for?

baird4444

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #19 on: April 17, 2009, 02:04:08 AM »
Try an Autoiite 4063....
             they've served me well for 6 years. A lot easier and cheaper to
find and buy - Mike
"You can't drink all day if you don't start in the morning!! "
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 but tomorrow I shall be sober and you will still be ugly'
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portisheadric

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #20 on: April 17, 2009, 06:43:51 AM »
Sounds like a shorting issue, where the spark travels down the outside of the ceramic around the centre electrode and shorts via the metal spark plug body.
It usually occurs due to oil or carbon fouling but perhaps there is something in the fuel that is coating the ceramic and allowing the spark to travel.

An iridium plug may be better because it may be easier for the spark to jump to the earth electrode rather than track down the ceramic due to the far smaller tip diameter.

I run my carburation close to between 12.5:1  &  13:1 which leaves the spark plug very sooty, a standard plug fouls pretty quickly (giving symptoms as you describe) but the iridium has been faultless for over 1500 miles.

RBHoge

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #21 on: April 17, 2009, 11:11:37 AM »
I appreciate your thoughts, but there is no continuity (Circuit) down the center electrode in the plugs after they go bad. It is as though the copper core running down the center of the NGK plugs breaks, or some how become separated from the terminal (stem) I wish I had an X-ray machine to look through the ceramic insulator, but the ideas which sold me on Enfield was simplicity and economy. For the cost of an X-ray machine I could probably purchase a gold plated BMW.

 It is not a "flash over" the plugs are clean on the outside and I ran the bike in the dark as the last plug was failing and there was no observable flashover or stray sparks anywhere. From the feel of the machine the spark was either intermittent, or there was no spark at all and the engine was "dieseling" (which I don't think is possible with the RE's low compression ratio.
   RBH
1972 Honda CB 450 Rufus, Murdered
1978 Triumph T-140 E, Sadly gone
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe Iron head, " Old Bill"
1971 Honda CB-100,"Kikuchiyo"-traded
O Day 20 Sailboat "Tempus Fugative"
1992 Mazda Miata "Lady Murisaki"250,00miles!
Too many Toys, what else is retirement for?

RBHoge

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #22 on: April 18, 2009, 03:05:47 PM »
 :-[  On close examination of my new Champion RN 2C plug at about 50 miles, I saw that it was jet black and "sooty". Wow, it was running rich as it could be and still run at all. I had wondered why I never had to choke the engine to start, even in cold weather. Upon browsing in this forum, I found a posting by our fearless leader Kevin Mahoney suggesting an inspection of the little rubber 'bootie' which covers the plunger on the "enricher" (Choke). mine was indeed loose and not allowing the "enricher" to turn off completely. It was a booger to get back on and I ended up removing the enricher just so that I could   roll the grommet back in place.  Now to clean up this latest spark plug  and maybe an NGK if I can find one that will make a complete circuit and give it a test run.

Thanks to all for advice and good wishes.   :-[
1972 Honda CB 450 Rufus, Murdered
1978 Triumph T-140 E, Sadly gone
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe Iron head, " Old Bill"
1971 Honda CB-100,"Kikuchiyo"-traded
O Day 20 Sailboat "Tempus Fugative"
1992 Mazda Miata "Lady Murisaki"250,00miles!
Too many Toys, what else is retirement for?

jaymark18

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #23 on: April 23, 2009, 10:13:51 PM »
We need to clean up this latest spark plug  and maybe an NGK if you can find one that will make a complete circuit and give it a test run.






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RBHoge

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2009, 03:32:29 PM »
 ???The Champion cleaned up OK and the bike ran great! Unfortunately the idle was way the heck out of adjustment.  It was idling at about two thousand rpm! I fiddled with the idle adjustment and only got it to move up to about three thousand.

 I cleaned all of the various spark plugs laying around and found not one NGK which would make a complete circuit. >:( I'm about to get the idle fixed, having read the section on the carburetor in the "Super Service Manual from CMW. More later.
1972 Honda CB 450 Rufus, Murdered
1978 Triumph T-140 E, Sadly gone
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe Iron head, " Old Bill"
1971 Honda CB-100,"Kikuchiyo"-traded
O Day 20 Sailboat "Tempus Fugative"
1992 Mazda Miata "Lady Murisaki"250,00miles!
Too many Toys, what else is retirement for?

REpozer

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #25 on: April 24, 2009, 05:50:52 PM »
From  30 years as a shade tree auto tinker, my plugs of choice has been Autolite,and NGKs,, Bosch Super 's work good for me too.I use Champian in my Briggs& Statton engines cause I can't find anything else.
2008 AVL Classic Bullet in British Racing Green
REA # 84 ( the first time)

RBHoge

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #26 on: May 29, 2009, 12:55:28 AM »
 ;D
Well, I've got "Old Bill" up and running (idle is now back down to a steady "tick-over")

Weather has been the wettest I have ever experienced since my government sponsored vacation to Monsoon land back in the early seventies, but it seems like we might soon see some good Tennessee sunshine at long last.  The Champion RN2C plug now has a little over two hundred miles on it and shows a nice golden tan colour on the electrode.

 With the enricher (choke) plunger now fixed, it is as though I have a different and much better bike.  The bike runs very strong, responds to the throttle and fuel mileage is back up to about 65 or 70 M.P.G. where it should be. :-* I'm quite happy with my Bullet!

RBH
1972 Honda CB 450 Rufus, Murdered
1978 Triumph T-140 E, Sadly gone
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe Iron head, " Old Bill"
1971 Honda CB-100,"Kikuchiyo"-traded
O Day 20 Sailboat "Tempus Fugative"
1992 Mazda Miata "Lady Murisaki"250,00miles!
Too many Toys, what else is retirement for?

Motor

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #27 on: June 03, 2009, 02:12:42 PM »

 I cleaned all of the various spark plugs laying around and found not one NGK which would make a complete circuit. >:( I'm about to get the idle fixed, having read the section on the carburetor in the "Super Service Manual from CMW. More later.

I am wondering if in fact you are dealing with a resistor type plug.  If you still have one that is destined for the trash, perhaps you could break off or crush with pliers the glossy white ceramic part that is on the top end of the plug between the hex body and the terminal.  Not the part that goes in the combustion chamber.  If it is a resistor plug, there will not be a solid conductor, but a densely compacted carbon powder.  If this is the case, then the continuity check will necessitate measurement in the Meg-Ohm range on your Ohm meter. It requires at least 1 Meg-Ohm or more in order to suppress the electrical "radiation" that interferes with other electrical equipment.  Some multi-testers are not capable of measuring such a high resistance. 

If you find that there is a solid wire type of conductor then you do not have a resistor plug and all of the above is merely irrelevant hot air on my part.  Would not be the first time.

Motor

RBHoge

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #28 on: June 04, 2009, 10:09:33 AM »
Hot Air??? you must be a baloon pilot. My meter reads up to 2meg oms. The @#%* NGK (No Good Krud) plugs Went worthless in less than one hundred miles (on average). If you have been reading the posts in this thread you would have learned that The main problem was a messed up 'enricher' on the carburettor causing soot fouling on the plugs. (Why that would cause the NGK's to punk out on me is still a mystery).

Still tinkering with bikes is part of the fun of owning them. If I didn't  like enjoy tinkering I would have bought a Honda, or BMW, or something so far techno-illogically advanced that only a factory trained wrench puller could work on it.    RBH   
1972 Honda CB 450 Rufus, Murdered
1978 Triumph T-140 E, Sadly gone
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe Iron head, " Old Bill"
1971 Honda CB-100,"Kikuchiyo"-traded
O Day 20 Sailboat "Tempus Fugative"
1992 Mazda Miata "Lady Murisaki"250,00miles!
Too many Toys, what else is retirement for?

Motor

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Re: Spark Plug
« Reply #29 on: June 04, 2009, 02:07:01 PM »
I just went and measured the resistance of the installed plug and also my spare plug.  Unbelievable.  The one in the motor was 3.5 K ohms, and my spare was 1.8 M ohms.  Such a wide variation is difficult for me to accept.  Perhaps it is time for me to switch away from NGK, also.  Thanks for giving me the motivation to do so. 

Motor