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September 02, 2014, 09:51:39 PM

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Author Topic: G5 Fuel Pump Problems  (Read 229 times)

gashousegorilla

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #15 on: Today at 02:04:51 AM »
 No.... your not looking for voltage at the sensor plug.  At the pump for voltage. And you should hear/ feel two relays clicking or pulling in, power relay and fuel pump.   And as Arizoni mentioned ... when the bike fails to start does the Mil light stay on ? 

  The pump needs a minimum of 6 volts to run... but if it's THAT low ?!   And the sensor does put out 3-5 v AC, but a resistance check should be telling....
« Last Edit: Today at 02:13:45 AM by gashousegorilla »
An thaibhsí atá rattling ag an doras agus tá sé an diabhal sa chathaoir.

dginfw

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #16 on: Today at 02:37:36 AM »
You should hear the relay click when you put the sidestand up before you even try the starter. If you had prior electrical problems the relay could have been damaged or unplugged
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gashousegorilla

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #17 on: Today at 02:54:18 AM »
  Yes..... I think he still has the side stand safety unplugged ? If so, key on power relay clicks. Kill switch to run, and as the ground is switched on to the pump relay, he should get a click at the pump relay as the pump primes then clicks off, until the start button is hit and the pump relay will click again.
An thaibhsí atá rattling ag an doras agus tá sé an diabhal sa chathaoir.

Arizoni

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #18 on: Today at 03:46:08 AM »
I did notice that if the MIL is lit and stays on and the error code is the 6 long/6 short readout, the service  manual says the engine will crank but not start.

Assuming the fuel pump is pumping (ever so quietly), I think the next thing to check  to see if there is any spark at the spark plug while the engine is cranking.

If it is sparking that might rule out (for the moment) the crank sensor.
If there is no spark at the plug, the crank sensor becomes a prime candidate.
Jim
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gashousegorilla

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #19 on: Today at 04:12:28 AM »
  A problem with the Crank sensor or circuit , may have the ECU NOT switching on the grounds through pin 11 and 18 to the pump relay and the ignition coil....  It may kill both.  So the starter would crank the motor, but not start.  So it would take one or the other, or both to prevent the bike from starting. 
An thaibhsí atá rattling ag an doras agus tá sé an diabhal sa chathaoir.

SteveThackery

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #20 on: Today at 07:46:44 AM »
There is one very large anomaly in your original post: the 5V at the fuel pump.

You really should follow this up before messing with anything else; and certainly don't start taking the side cover off just yet.

You see, no matter what the ECU has logged by way of fault codes, there are only two correct voltages at the fuel pump: 0V or 12V.  This is because, as mentioned earlier, it's driven by a relay.  If you really are seeing only 5V at the fuel pump then you have already found the fault

As mentioned earlier, it is essential that you connect both leads of your voltmeter to the connector for the fuel pump, and that the connector is plugged into the pump when testing.  Only then are you doing a legitimate test of the pump voltage.

I strongly suggest you do that, and clarify once and for all just what voltage is getting to the fuel pump, before doing anything else.  Would you do so and report back to us?

gashousegorilla

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #21 on: Today at 10:39:30 AM »
 +1   The pump is either on or off.
An thaibhsí atá rattling ag an doras agus tá sé an diabhal sa chathaoir.

ROVERMAN

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #22 on: Today at 12:50:44 PM »
I think i am correct in saying that if there is no primary ignition circuit (bad connection to the crank sensor for example) you will have no fuel pump operation. Maybe the 5v at the fuel pump is a pull-up voltage used by the ECU for diagnostics?
Good luck, Roverman.

gashousegorilla

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #23 on: Today at 01:36:33 PM »
  You know ?   Could be... I think I remember seeing that on another sensor.. Might have been the map sensor?
 
 And he is mentioning checking at a blue wire,  I know there is one unused blue wire on the pump side of the plug... the harness side is two wire.  May mean nothing however.. But If he is checking there , at that blue wire and sees 5v ,I would think he would have 12v  at the harness side of the plug.
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SteveThackery

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #24 on: Today at 04:09:47 PM »
Does anyone know for sure what colour the 12V feed and the earth wires at the pump should be?

They are red/white and black respectively on Scalyback's diagram, but I don't know if this reflects everyone's bike accurately.

Until we know for sure whether the pump is getting 12V on those connections there is no point in going any further. It is the first and most basic test to be performed.

gashousegorilla

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #25 on: Today at 06:03:59 PM »
Does anyone know for sure what colour the 12V feed and the earth wires at the pump should be?

They are red/white and black respectively on Scalyback's diagram, but I don't know if this reflects everyone's bike accurately.




   Yes sir.... That's how it was on my bike.  And it is not the blue wire on the pump side of the plug, it's unused. I would check for voltage on the pump side of the plug, using the other two wires. This way, he is also confirming the connection inside the plug is good.  Bad connections in that plug have been seen before.....
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SteveThackery

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #26 on: Today at 08:43:30 PM »
All such faults need testing in a logical sequence.  It's no good making guesses about what MIGHT be causing it.

As several of us have said, the first thing to check is that there is 12V across the pump terminals.

If there is, and the pump is not running, then the pump is faulty.  If there is not, then the fault is elsewhere, so we go on to step 2.......

REG5

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #27 on: Today at 09:12:09 PM »
I had the multimeter ready to check the pump voltage (sewing needle in both red and black wires going to fuel pump) switched the killswitch to run, and low and behold, the pump whirred. This makes me think its a connection issue since I had just messed with the connector. Is there any way to be sure? Thanks!
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REG5

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #28 on: Today at 09:15:39 PM »
Even when the pump was on, I couldn't get a voltage reading, is there a better way to get a reading besides inserting needles into the connector? The connector is kind of tough to get to, is there a way to disconnect the the harness from the pump to make inserting the needle more sure?
« Last Edit: Today at 09:30:30 PM by REG5 »
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singhg5

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Re: G5 Fuel Pump Problems
« Reply #29 on: Today at 09:29:55 PM »
Even when the pump was on, I couldn't get a voltage reading, is there a better way to get a reading besides inserting needles into the connector? The connector is kind of tough to get to, is there a way to disconnect the the harness from the pump?

If you mean how to disconnect fuel pump connector from main harness, check this video -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1mn2JVPmac   
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