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Author Topic: C5 & "competition"  (Read 6248 times)

Blue Ridge Wheeltor

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #30 on: September 13, 2009, 06:51:02 PM »
Got specs?

Just posted on the motherboard:

"For those who are interested in Ural solo:

Available February-March 2010. Considering assembly in the US.

MSRP: around $8000

Specs - read below. Please note: this is a prototype, specs may change.

Model name, paint scheme, trim details open for suggestions.


Front forks Marzocchi, 40mm
Front brake - Brembo, 4 pistons, full floating disk
Rear brake - Brembo 2 pistons
Rear shocks - Sachs
Gear box - 4-speed, no reverse
Final drive ratio - 3.89
Wheels - 18"
Tires Heidenau K36

Seat height - 750mm (29.4)
Dry weight - 210kg (460 lbs)

Estimated top speed - 90mph
Recommended cruising speed - 70 mph
Estimated fuel economy 45 mpg
Estimated range 250 miles



Ilya Khait
President, IMWA"
REA #25
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe (Blue)
2006 Ural Patrol
1978 BMW R 100s--SOLD--
1977 HD XLCR
1971 Triumph Bonneville

ace.cafe

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #31 on: September 13, 2009, 07:21:43 PM »
Amen, Brs. Ace and Dannie!  By the way, Tom, I was at that ATL show and stopped by the RE booth a couple of times.  In addition to looking at the bikes, I wanted to meet Tait Bolton and visit with him for a bit.  He was getting something to eat when Graciela, my wife, and I made our first stop by the booth.  She and I, coincidentally, were hungry ourselves and left to get a bite to eat, also.

We went back to the RE booth some thirty minutes later and met and chatted with Tait and another fellow who was with him.  So, as it turns out, I saw you and spoke with you twice on that Saturday afternoon!  Now, this pleasent surprise is worth, at minimum and in honor of our chance meeting and that gorgeous red Deluxe, one Sunday: WOWZAA!!!

Papa Juan,
Well, how about that!!!???
I was eating lunch with Tait at the concession stand, when you missed us, and had to come back later.
The Bullet world is a pretty small world.

Yeah, I was that nut with Tait!
I hope I made a good impression.
I was trying to be on my best behavior! :D

I'm happy that we did meet back then, and we had no idea what the future was going to bring.

Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
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ace.cafe

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #32 on: September 13, 2009, 07:23:44 PM »
Just posted on the motherboard:

"For those who are interested in Ural solo:

Available February-March 2010. Considering assembly in the US.

MSRP: around $8000

Specs - read below. Please note: this is a prototype, specs may change.

Model name, paint scheme, trim details open for suggestions.


Front forks Marzocchi, 40mm
Front brake - Brembo, 4 pistons, full floating disk
Rear brake - Brembo 2 pistons
Rear shocks - Sachs
Gear box - 4-speed, no reverse
Final drive ratio - 3.89
Wheels - 18"
Tires Heidenau K36

Seat height - 750mm (29.4)
Dry weight - 210kg (460 lbs)

Estimated top speed - 90mph
Recommended cruising speed - 70 mph
Estimated fuel economy 45 mpg
Estimated range 250 miles



Ilya Khait
President, IMWA"


I think that a solo bike is something that could be good for Ural.

Not my cup of tea, but I'm sure that many will find it appealing.
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

exiledcarper

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #33 on: September 13, 2009, 07:38:05 PM »
Ural already have a solo bike, the Wolf.  It's a kind of chopper/custom style apparently inspired by the Russian Wolf motorcycle gang and their style of bike.
  I'm thinking this new solo will most likely be a more standard kind of bike, much like a vintage Beemer.
  Sounds like a winner, especially as ural have apparently made great strides in improving long time weaknesses, such as the charging system.

exiledcarper

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #34 on: September 13, 2009, 07:53:57 PM »
Oops, I just looked back at page 2 and saw the link to the bike ::).  Looks like a decent standard styled bike, but have to agree that it's probably a bit overpriced and yes, I am one of those who thinks that the UCE is way overpriced too. 
  Every one seems to forget how cheap these bikes are in their home market.  Desireable?  Definitely, but at a VERY premium price for a very bsaic machine made very cheaply in a third world country.  I'm sure I'll get slaughtered again, but that's the just the way I honestly see it.

Cabo Cruz

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #35 on: September 13, 2009, 08:33:51 PM »
"Apples and oranges.  yes, the price is about 1k high, but some think $6400++ for a single cylinder Enfield is high.  Owerweight? Steel weighs more than plastic.  Underpowered? Some might argue that a bike not able to cruise at 65 is underpowered. Only 45 hp, but even the nes Ural with sidecar can cruise at 65, this one should run all day at 75."  BRW

Br. Blue, I was not comparing the Ural solo to the Bullet when I asked the three questions above.  But since you took that route... yes, "apples and oranges", indeed because:

a) You are comparing a twin to a single.
(In the last year, I sold a 2005 Hinckley Bonneville and a 2006 Ducati Monster.  The performance of Perla did not in any way compare to that of either of the twins.  She does handle better than the Bonneville.  Conversely, she does not handle better than the Monster.)

b) "Owerweight?  Steel weighs more than plastic."
(You, undoubtedly, were thinking of another -- or other -- motorcycle(s) besides the Bullet because, with the exception of the lights' lenses, there is no plastic on a Bullet.  The Bonneville at a 461 lbs. claimed dry weight is, objectively speaking, overweight.  It has a claimed 61 hp maximum.  The Ural solo at a 460 lbs. claimed dry weight is, also objectively speaking, overweight.  The claimed 45 hp figure does, objectively speaking, make the Ural underpowered.  The Hinckley Bonneville at 61 hp, in contrast, is not underpowered.)

c) "Some might argue that a bike not able to cruise at 65 is underpowered."
(Here you seem to refer to the IB or AVL engines and not the UCE engine.  This does not square because you used the "$6400++" price figure.  So, you appear to be mixing the new UCE cost with the performance of an IB or AVL Bullet.  In any case, Perla can, has and does cruise at 65 mph.  For top speed, she broke 80 (GPS) mph.  Her modifications, besides carrying a 160 lb. rider, are: 1) Approximately 30 lbs. off her claimed dry weight of 370 lbs.; 2) PAV off; 3) 34 mm carb.; 4) K&N filter; and 5) straight through header pipe and Goldstar muffler.

In any case, the (admiration and) purchase of a bike is, at minimum, 90% subjective.  So, I encourage you, Br. Blue, to buy a new Ural solo and wish you the absolute best of times with it.  :)
Long live the Bullets and those who ride them!

Keep the shiny side up, the boots on the pegs and best REgards,

Papa Juan

REA:    Member No. 119
BIKE:   2004 Royal Enfield Sixty-5
NAME: Perla

Cabo Cruz

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #36 on: September 13, 2009, 08:38:02 PM »
"I'm happy that we did meet back then, and we had no idea what the future was going to bring."  ace.cafe

Amen, Br. Ace!!!  :D
Long live the Bullets and those who ride them!

Keep the shiny side up, the boots on the pegs and best REgards,

Papa Juan

REA:    Member No. 119
BIKE:   2004 Royal Enfield Sixty-5
NAME: Perla

Blue Ridge Wheeltor

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #37 on: September 14, 2009, 12:42:03 AM »
The Ural is .09785 hp per lb. The Enfield is .0667. Seems like the Enfield is the one underpowered.

Cabo: I can understand your changing to the Enfield because your irding style may have changed, but surely you can't think the Enfield is a better put together or better value bike than the Ducati or triumph?
« Last Edit: September 14, 2009, 01:39:12 AM by Blue Ridge Wheeltor »
REA #25
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe (Blue)
2006 Ural Patrol
1978 BMW R 100s--SOLD--
1977 HD XLCR
1971 Triumph Bonneville

UncleErnie

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #38 on: September 14, 2009, 01:51:23 AM »
Alllright.  Let's put our big-boy pants on here.  Both bikes are over-priced and underpowered.  So?  Talking about someone's bike is like talking about somone's wife.

For those of you who envy Blue Ridge Wheeltor's bikes and riding prowess on his BMW (named Apollo 11), here is a story written about him (name was changed) descibing his far-reaching circumfrances of mitigating circumstances; 
  http://w6rec.com/duane/bmw/boo.htm
Run what ya brung

Blue Ridge Wheeltor

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #39 on: September 14, 2009, 01:53:47 AM »
You're supposed to help me get Cabo wound up! Poor sport.
REA #25
2008 Royal Enfield Deluxe (Blue)
2006 Ural Patrol
1978 BMW R 100s--SOLD--
1977 HD XLCR
1971 Triumph Bonneville

ace.cafe

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #40 on: September 14, 2009, 02:14:25 AM »
I really can't answer properly, because I'm a zealot, and my perception  is skewed by the permanent vision of Enfield in front of my eyes.

However, I can say that I had a deposit down on a brand new Ducati 1000 Sport in bright yellow, that I retracted and didn't buy. That was after I saw the Bullet in the flesh at the Atlanta Bike Expo. And of course, after seeing that I liked it better than the Triumph too. And the Ducati  really didn't look like the old vintage 750 Sport anyway, after recovering from the initial excitement, and realizing it was just basically a yellow Monster that said "Sport" on it.

But, I didn't want a brand new Bullet. That was the rub. I wanted one that had been around the block a bit. One that I could give some TLC to, because I have this need for that sort of thing. So it took a few months to find the 2000 Black Deluxe that I eventually bought.

I guess that's a long way around to saying that when I voted with my money, I picked a used  Bullet, and not the Ducati or the Triumph.
Maybe it wasn't originally put together as well as a brand new Trump or Duc.  
But it is now.
And I like it better, and that's what counts.

« Last Edit: September 14, 2009, 02:19:18 AM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/AcePerformanceBullets/info

r80rt

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #41 on: September 14, 2009, 02:28:20 AM »
I like all bikes of all types, sizes and shapes, including mopeds and scooters. I was riding a 05 Bonnie black thinking of getting a 620 monster. Then I saw the C5 and forgot everything else, it gives me everything I've always wanted in a bike and none of the crap I don't want. For me Royal Enfield got it 100% right,. Ride what makes you grin the most ;D
On the eighth day God created the C5, and it was better looking than anything on the planet.
Iron Butt Association

Cabo Cruz

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #42 on: September 14, 2009, 02:45:03 AM »
"The Ural is .09785 hp per lb. The Enfield is .0667. Seems like the Enfield is the one underpowered."  BRW

Well, Br Blue, here we go, again... I once more fail to understand the reason you went through the exercise of comparing the Ural to the Bullet.  I remind you that I compare the Ural solo to the Hinckley Bonneville -- two twins -- and I am in no way trying to convince you to rate the Bullet better than the Ural.  So, to this end, we can see that the HP to Weight Ratio of the Bonneville is .13232 hp/lb. versus .09785 hp/lb. for the Ural.  This gives the Bonneville a rounded off advantage of 34% hp/lb. over the Ural.

"Cabo: I can understand your changing to the Enfield because your irding style may have changed, but surely you can't think the Enfield is a better put together or better value bike than the Ducati or triumph?"  BRW

Well, Br. Blue, I either misrepresented my points or you misunderstood them.  My statements did not overrated the Bullet or underrated the Bonneville or the Ducati.  Several moons ago I noted in this forum that both the British and the Italian bikes were fine machines and that I was keeping Perla for subjective reasons.  I have nothing but praise for the Bonneville and the Ducati.  How can I best explain my logic for selling and not selling bikes?  Let's try this: I like the two other bikes very much and I love Perla!

Now, does Perla have long legs?  Not really!  Did the two other bikes have the legs?  Plenty and plenty!  Do I have a very fine Bullet?  You bet!  Even though I really like the C5 and G5, do I want another single 500 cc bike.  Well, I am not sure, frankly.  What am I doing to find Perla a stable mate?  I am looking at the Moto Guzzi V7 because a) I do like the performance of a twin, b) I like their longer legs and c) my riding style has not changed.

In closing, Br. Blue, I can assure you that I do not wish to turn this debate into the -- similarly subjective, emotional and personal -- political and religious debates that I habitually avoid.  These lead us to make counterproductive, condescending statements like: "... but surely you can't think the Enfield is a better put together or better value bike than the Ducati or triumph?"  For these reasons, I close (this post and debate) as I did in my earlier response: "In any case, the (admiration and) purchase of a bike is, at minimum, 90% subjective.  So, I encourage you, Br. Blue, to buy a new Ural solo and wish you the absolute best of times with it."  :)
Long live the Bullets and those who ride them!

Keep the shiny side up, the boots on the pegs and best REgards,

Papa Juan

REA:    Member No. 119
BIKE:   2004 Royal Enfield Sixty-5
NAME: Perla

Eamon

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #43 on: September 14, 2009, 02:53:21 AM »
retro
soul
character
unique
simple
durability
collectable
no competition....I would agree. Nothing i would sell my Enfield for...

until now...
http://sovietsteeds.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=8849

Hmm... I like it ok, but would like it a lot better if they just offered the Retro model in a solo again.  I suppose I might like the one in those pictures better with fork tube covers or gaiters, and a tractor seat / rear rack combo.  Still, if I was thinking about something bigger than my Bullet (like a Bonnie or Guzzi V7) I'd certainly consider it.  I think I'd still prefer a C5, although a Ural Retro solo would be tempting!

Eamon
Eamon in Seattle
2006 Bullet 500 Deluxe
http://www.sterlingloons.com

UncleErnie

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Re: C5 & "competition"
« Reply #44 on: September 14, 2009, 03:12:34 AM »
Most dealers are sold out of this years models, but I don't think you can beat that V7 Classic for over-all performance and looks.  It's a great bike.  If i was looking for a new bike, that would be at the top of the list.
Run what ya brung