HPRE

Menu

Members Rides

Bullet


in
Members Rides

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
September 02, 2014, 04:53:34 AM

Login with username, password and session length

 

Author Topic: Dont ask dont tell.  (Read 2214 times)

clamp

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 2108
  • Karma: 0
Dont ask dont tell.
« on: October 12, 2009, 06:24:38 AM »
I have heard that the American army or forces allow unknown or undeclared sexual deviances such as gays and homosexuals to be allowed to enter the army to  active duty even as lovers or married couples ?

      Is this true?   I am so shocked at this I dare not say anything until I know more about it.
I would never be a member of a cub that would have me as a member

Alaroyal

  • Bulleteer
  • ***
  • Posts: 173
  • Karma: 0
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2009, 01:06:23 PM »
If the "don't ask, don't tell" policy is followed, then yes is the answer.  If no one asks, and the couple doesn't tell, how would the military know?
Dave

"The reason most people don't recognize opportunity when it knocks, is because opportunity almost wears work clothes."

mbevo1

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 724
  • Karma: 0
  • Mike and Stumpy
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2009, 01:19:47 PM »
Clamp -

The US Armed Forces have long held that homosexual behavior is "a detriment to good order and discipline" and the Uniform Code of Military Justice prohibits this behavior.  It is punishable under the UCMJ (along with many other practices that society would not really consider out of the ordinary, like adultery).  

President Clinton decided to change the policy to "don't ask, don't tell".  It basically says the Government will not ask, and the service member is not obligated to tell if they engage in homosexual activity.  However, it remains an offense under the UCMJ if the service member is caught in the act, or decides to come out and proclaim their sexual orientation.  When I entered the military, there was a question on the application that asked "are you now, or have you ever engaged in..."  I suspect that question went away as part of "don't ask, don't tell".

President Obama offered a campaign promise to end "don't ask, don't tell", but reaffirmed the existing policy in his first few weeks as President.  Had a march in D.C. last weekend from those who wan't to see the changes made now...

Existing policy is confusing, to say the least...

Mike and Stumpy in Michigan
'07 Classic - Stumpy
'10 C5 Military - Sherman

The Garbone

  • Shade Tree
  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 4001
  • Karma: 0
  • User Complaints: 22
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2009, 02:48:47 PM »
I was in from 91 to 97..  When I was signing up the recruiter had the old questioneer with the question lined out.  

Truth be told there are quite a number of gays in the service, and no one really cares.   I was aware of 3 people getting the boot for being gay at commands I was assigned to.   One was a shit bag and did not like the discipline of the service so used it to get out.  The other two were caught on watch by the CO doing the deed.   Funny story that.  The majority were good sailors so no one cared.  

Also of note when I was in there was a female Officer in the AirFarce that was kicked out for sleeping with a female subordinates husband (who was a civilian).  She was told to stop and did not so got the axe..  

IMO the policy should be left alone,  but leftist like social engineering and doing shit that kills troop moral so here we go again.
Gary
57' RE Crusader 250
67' Ford Mustang
74' Catalina 27 "Knot a Clew"
95 RE Ace Clubman 535
01 HD 1200 Custom
07 RE 5spd HaCK

* all actions described in this post are fictional *

Chasfield

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 1386
  • Karma: 0
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2009, 04:29:45 PM »
Yeah, they think that :

1) they can fix everything
2) everything needs fixing

They especially don't like compromises or grey areas that are there for sound or just humane reasons.

Thus, they rush in where angels fear to tread.
2001 500 Bullet Deluxe

UncleErnie

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 2545
  • Karma: 0
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2009, 05:52:14 PM »
Gay folks are everywhere.  Some are even marrried to the opposite sex.  BFD. 
I've been propositioned and I said, "No thanks".  Who cares?

It's not contagious, you know. 
Run what ya brung

Eamon

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 936
  • Karma: 0
  • Good golly Miss Molly
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2009, 05:52:09 PM »
 ::)  Gimme a break!  Us terrible leftists!  If the military values honesty and integrity, they wouldn't ask members to be dishonest or secretive about who they are.  Nobody can tell me a sound or humane reason for discrimination against gays in the military because there are none.  We should be happy to accept anyone who wants to serve his or her country.   :P

Eamon
Eamon in Seattle
2006 Bullet 500 Deluxe
http://www.sterlingloons.com

mbevo1

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 724
  • Karma: 0
  • Mike and Stumpy
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2009, 06:54:08 PM »
Just a couple more cents...

First off, I got nothin' against nobody... but the "who prefers to do what with whom" question DOES make it harder to do things... I can comment a little on the problems with how to make this work - at least aboard ship.  For those who ain't been there, its tough to describe how cramped living conditions are at sea...

Used to be that gals weren't allowed to serve in our ships.  One reason was that, at the time, females could not serve in "combat" jobs.  That restriction has since been lifted.  Second reason was, our ships were never designed to accommodate both sexes, and its hard to make changes to do it, particularly on smaller ships (I heard recently we will be putting females on our submarines).  Then you have the major question of how to keep guys and gals from doing what guys and gals do...  you can provide separate berthing and regulations against it, but it's tough to fight biology, and good 'ol biology can interfere with damn near everything (I recall with fondness...).

Speaking to folks I served with who are in positions of Command today, all of the above are "issues".  Most will say that things were certainly easier, less expensive, and very likely more efficient under the "old" way.  Our Navy has changed, but it isn't entirely for the better.

The same folks say that trying to make "guys and gays" work together in the confines of shipboard life will add one more layer to the difficulties.  Would a Commander berth two people together when one may have a sexual preference towards their roomate?  Does it make sense to berth gay men or lesbians together (biology again).   Do you put gay men with lesbian women?  Gets complicated...

I served with men and women who were gay - they told me.  They were good friends and good sailors.  They knew what the regs were and knew they could not practice their sexual preference and still serve.  Damn grateful I never had to make that sacrifice.  

No matter how you slice it, it makes things harder.

Mike and Stumpy in Michigan
« Last Edit: October 13, 2009, 12:09:04 AM by mbevo1 »
'07 Classic - Stumpy
'10 C5 Military - Sherman

Ice

  • Hypercafienated
  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 5084
  • Karma: 0
  • Ride In Paradise Cabo, Don and Ernie
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2009, 11:02:25 PM »
  Our Armed Forces are a unique sub culture of America.
 The don't ask don't tell policies in place now work for them as does the various no fraternization and the public displays of affection policies that are in place.

 lets leave them to do the job at hand and not muck about in the workings of their business to accommodate the wishes of those outside of their organization.
 



 
 
 
I can break it better,,,,at night, in the rain, on the trail,, 20 miles from nowhere.

REA #136

"TIMEX", the '06 Iron Barrel Military that takes me everywhere I want to go... and some places I shouldn't.

Eamon

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 936
  • Karma: 0
  • Good golly Miss Molly
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2009, 11:20:52 PM »
I'll say it again:
If the military values honesty and integrity, it is hypocrisy to ask members to be dishonest or secretive about who they are.

Gay people have always been in the military and always will be.  If we value honesty and integrity in our military we'd drop the facade.  As Uncle Ernie said, it's not contagious!

Eamon
Eamon in Seattle
2006 Bullet 500 Deluxe
http://www.sterlingloons.com

Ice

  • Hypercafienated
  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 5084
  • Karma: 0
  • Ride In Paradise Cabo, Don and Ernie
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2009, 11:34:46 PM »
 The Armed Forces also value good order,discretion and self discipline and a litany of other values hence the policies and regulations as they are now.
 
 Besides don't ask don't tell, fraternization, public displays of affection they also have policies on things like writing bad checks, drunk and disorderly conduct, D.W.I. personal responsibility, child support etc. etc.

 I see no need to alter their culture as it is working well for them.
I can break it better,,,,at night, in the rain, on the trail,, 20 miles from nowhere.

REA #136

"TIMEX", the '06 Iron Barrel Military that takes me everywhere I want to go... and some places I shouldn't.

REA Member 131

  • Scooter
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • Karma: 0
  • I'd rather push my Enfield than ride a Harley
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2009, 12:08:34 AM »
I think you should have to be gay to serve in the military. War is just a Freudian penis size thing anyway. Besides, remember the guys in the Village People? They were pretty scary looking.

< served 12 years in the Army.... and that was enough

ace.cafe

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 8172
  • Karma: 0
  • World leaders in racing or performance Bullets
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #12 on: October 13, 2009, 12:13:16 AM »
Well, I'm really happy for his little "love fest".
Seems alot like "interior re-decorating on the Titanic".

Now that that's over with, maybe he might start figuring out where that 2 Trillion Dollars went,  that he handed over to the bankers.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2009, 12:20:14 AM by ace.cafe »
Home of the ACE Fireball 535 Bullet,  Ace GP Hi-Lift Roller Rocker Head . Pistons, cams, etc. Highest performance Bullet engine mods available .  AVL mods. Redditch 700/750 Twin mods. UCE kit soon.

Please visit my new website:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/AcePerformanceBullets/

Eamon

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 936
  • Karma: 0
  • Good golly Miss Molly
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #13 on: October 13, 2009, 12:16:35 AM »
I think you should have to be gay to serve in the military. War is just a Freudian penis size thing anyway. Besides, remember the guys in the Village People? They were pretty scary looking.

< served 12 years in the Army.... and that was enough

If I saw the Village People coming at me with guns, I'd get the F outta their way!  :D
Eamon in Seattle
2006 Bullet 500 Deluxe
http://www.sterlingloons.com

UncleErnie

  • Grand Gearhead
  • *****
  • Posts: 2545
  • Karma: 0
Re: Dont ask dont tell.
« Reply #14 on: October 13, 2009, 12:28:21 AM »
What any branch of the government AND the American public say they value, and the reality, are diametrically opposed, IMHO.  I watch what goes on in Washington these days with disgust, but the citizens voted for every individual and continue to support it.

Just let me ride a motorcycle here in the mountains.   
Run what ya brung