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Author Topic: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?  (Read 2183 times)

WillW

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #30 on: July 13, 2010, 07:35:50 AM »
I don't know what it looks like, but presumably he does - he's the mechanic, so let's hope so... :-\
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clubman

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #31 on: July 13, 2010, 07:59:14 AM »
So is your dealer going to replace the auto decompressor - or is it wait and see ?

It's wait and see. Which I'm quite OK with as it's not done it for a while now.

qgolden

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #32 on: July 13, 2010, 03:47:47 PM »
You know I was re-reading this post for the second or third time and I see you (for good reasons) have been focused on the decompressor.  In your first message or so you indicate it seemed to be coming from the starter area.

What if the Bendix drive in the starter is not fully engaging?  That would allow the teeth to mesh, perhaps enough to begin to turn the motor, then when the motor begins to turn the alignment betwixt the starter drive gears and the clutch basket gears lines up and then drive gear sets in the rest of the way.  Under load it would be quite a THWACK when it sets.  Conversely what if the starter drive has a chipped tooth, so when it just happens that the starter drive is lined up with the teeth on the clutch basket  in that particular tooth, it slips to the next tooth causing a loud and unpleasant noise.

The starter is pretty easy to remove and check.  I would think  if that were the problem then the damage is on the starter side rather than the flywheel side because of the frequency of the issue.  The starter has maybe 8 or 10 teeth on it and the flywheel a 70 or so.  So statistically the problem would present itself once every 8 starts if it were on the starter side and once every 70 or so starts if it were on the clutch side.  It seems to me from reading the post that the frequency of the issue might average once every 8 or so starts?

Just a thought, my .02 your mileage may vary!   ;)
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WillW

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #33 on: July 13, 2010, 04:48:18 PM »
Well, it's another theory, and thanks for your input. I didn't actually say it was coming from the starter area, but just when starting. It's not ocurred for the last few days, and I've started up repeatedly quite a bit to see if I can repeat the fault, so naturally I'm hoping the happy bike fairy has made the problem go away ;)
It is quite a disconcerting THWACK, as you say, or wheeze-thwack, wheeze-thwack more like, as the thing turns over, but seems from deeper in the bowels than the starter itself. But yes, since the starter is pretty easy to get off I'll check it out. I am more inclined to the auto decompressor theory though because of others' reports of such a fault, and because it just sounds like something more out of kilter than a broken tooth. I'll let you know..... :-\
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qgolden

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #34 on: July 13, 2010, 06:34:08 PM »
Maybe you can try to get into a habit of laying you hand on the side of the Clutch Side Cover or the Starter Gear Cover on top of the Clutch Side Cover when you start it for a bit,  If is is in there and it occurs, I think you will feel it.   'Course it will also be entertaining for the neighbors if you are using a kick start!  ;D 

That might help you figure out if it is in the front side or back side of the motor.  There are not too many options to cause the issue in each end....you just havta' figger' out which end...
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clubman

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #35 on: July 13, 2010, 08:07:35 PM »
To be fair I did say I first thought it seemed to be from the starter area. Your theory is certainly interesting and logical but I think unlikely in my case since it's not been so much a case of every eight starts as every start for a while only to have completely gone away. That the same thing seems to have happened with Will at the same time is spooky indeed, though from the sound of it his case was worse and longer. 

mbevo1

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #36 on: July 13, 2010, 08:09:29 PM »
What if the Bendix drive in the starter is not fully engaging? 

I'm just throwing this out, 'cause I've got an '07 iron-lung  - which has undergone a sucessfull starterectomy...  ;)

I've heard the UCE starting system is similar to the "old" e-start - which doesn't use a Bendix.  It uses the sprague clutch to engage the starting gears... until it attempts to turn backwards a couple of times.  Then it becomes metal bits in the primary case...

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qgolden

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #37 on: July 13, 2010, 09:25:00 PM »
mbevo1
I believe you are right regarding the Sprag unit. I think I read that somewhere as well.  My Bad.

Still viable for the same problem though of a nicked gear. But, as clubman pointed out it went away for a while completely so maybe not the starter gear, But why would the decompressor give the issue every once in a while?  Of course I have never seen a bike with an automatic decompressor until now, so I know nothing more than what I have read here.

I think I would still pull the starter to eliminate it.  It is an easy job.  Could possibly start a bunch of times without happening to hit the bad tooth, then hit it three or four times in a row.  Murphy's law you know, it will only happen at the worst possible times. Of course I am pretty Anal Retentive and when I get in idea into my head and usually have to prove myself wrong before I can move on ... ::)
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SSR

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #38 on: July 14, 2010, 08:33:31 AM »
IT happens when the autodecomp does not de-compresses and engine backfires resulting in all the torque getting on to the sprag bearing which isn't designed to rotate clockwise.

siddharthmenon

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #39 on: July 14, 2010, 04:11:47 PM »
Even for me this problem has not repeated since long time. If it was teeth or bearing it should have continued right ? I am banking more on the auto decomp theory, may be it decomp parts has settle down properly.
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WillW

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #40 on: July 14, 2010, 05:21:19 PM »
I'm pretty sure it's NOT teeth, judging by the intermittent nature of the problem, and by the sound - which just aint teeth.... :-\  
And I'm CERTAIN it's not the bearing  ???
Good luck. Hope it stays quiet. So far so good with mine...... :)
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qgolden

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #41 on: July 14, 2010, 10:48:34 PM »
Well, if you solve the problem what are we gonna' have to talk about?       ;D
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WillW

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Re: What's that CLACK when she turns over but wont start?
« Reply #42 on: July 14, 2010, 11:40:49 PM »
Oh there'll be something - there always is, isn't there.....? ;)
2010 Royal Enfield Electra (G5) DL

2004 Kawasaki W650
~ the best british bike they never made ~