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Author Topic: G-5 Oil change Enigma  (Read 1817 times)

jjoe256

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G-5 Oil change Enigma
« on: August 22, 2010, 07:38:05 PM »
   Had Singh's experience with the process, oil filter, screen, draining everything possible, buttoned the lot up with new filter, added 1.6 liters of 20w50 oil, with bike on center stand, level popped up to middle of sight glass, cool. Fired her up to circulate the oil, let run for a few, shut it off, let it settle, oil now at bottom of glass, lower than low level, called it good pending hard ride, 2100 miles on the clock. With extra oil on board, went for a ride, about 6 freeway miles, speeds up to 81 indicated. Stop to check the oil level, assuming I had nailed it only to see a pool of oil forming under the bike. Usual seeps under kickstart shaft, all drains and pugs dry, only to find oil dripping from the air box!! WTF!!. It was dry with the oil at the top mark when hot before the change after really hot,  hard riding in 95-100 degree heat and long 5-6% graded terrain,oil level now when hot just above low level, everything should be cool! Wrong! Any ideas? I plan to remove the air box cover and see whats being pumped up the breather. I had a previous air box oil problem from dealer's work, so I was aware of the issue, tried to avoid it but Murphy wouldn't comply. Thanx upfront!

hocko

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2010, 11:44:37 PM »
Crankcase overfilled, I've done the same myself in the past, with the same result. What I did yesterday was measure the oil drained and replace that amount with the same amount of new oil. After this it wasn't visable in the sight glass even after running the engine for a few minutes. added another third of a pint brought it up to between the level marks. No problems. One of the RE mysteries of life  ;).

Hope this helps.

Cheers  :)

jjoe256

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2010, 11:59:31 PM »
Thanx, but I still think there should be a better hydrodynamic explanation. The oil level was below the low level before I started the ride, and the amount I added was lower than the 1.8-2 l mentioned elsewhere. Mysteries I get, had similar issues with an Aprilia not involving the air box, just the impossibility of dialing it in.

jjoe256

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2010, 12:18:52 AM »
Should have also added: overfilling in the glass is one thing, getting up to the airbox another. I'm sure suction is part of the problem, but the level was never high enough to create the airbox problem. I've had levels higher without the issue.

singhg5

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2010, 12:24:13 AM »
Jjoe256:

I don't think it is something to worry about as Hocko has written in his post.  Even though it is hard to imagine that you took all the precautions and still there was oil in breather tube.  Sometimes it happens when you run too hard or quickly accelerate or even if there is a rough ride.  A slight overfill can also do that.  What is the oil level now ?

It takes a little time to get to know these bikes - unlike very precise machines churned out by Japanese and German companies.  You will see that it gets better with time.  
1970's Jawa /  Yezdi
2006 Honda Nighthawk
2009 Royal Enfield Black G5

jjoe256

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2010, 12:29:14 AM »
Oil level is below low level, bike on the ground, using a level placed on the case to find true level, engine hot level is low-mid between the low and high mark, and the oil saturated the airbox and filter.

singhg5

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2010, 12:39:48 AM »
Should have also added: overfilling in the glass is one thing, getting up to the airbox another. I'm sure suction is part of the problem, but the level was never high enough to create the airbox problem. I've had levels higher without the issue.

You are right.  need to rethink.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2010, 03:14:27 AM by singhg5 »
1970's Jawa /  Yezdi
2006 Honda Nighthawk
2009 Royal Enfield Black G5

jjoe256

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2010, 01:37:09 AM »
Who knows? The filter is dicey to line everything up, but the plug went into the filter hole through the 2 washers and screwed down easily. My drain plug was screwed up before I got it, but I think the problem is related to initial trial. I'll know better tomorrow when I run it with air box open so I can get a feel for the crankcase pressure. I don't know how an oil pressure problem could force oil up the tube. I think there's just lot's of splash and agitation and suction from the airbox would suck the splash up the tube, but the level wasn't high enough, hence my enigma. Understand, I always imagine the worst, and am relieved by the not so bad!!

singhg5

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2010, 01:45:01 AM »
Who knows? The filter is dicey to line everything up, but the plug went into the filter hole through the 2 washers and screwed down easily. My drain plug was screwed up before I got it, but I think the problem is related to initial trial. I'll know better tomorrow when I run it with air box open so I can get a feel for the crankcase pressure. I don't know how an oil pressure problem could force oil up the tube. I think there's just lot's of splash and agitation and suction from the airbox would suck the splash up the tube, but the level wasn't high enough, hence my enigma. Understand, I always imagine the worst, and am relieved by the not so bad!!

I can relate to that  :D.  May be it is something about RE - it takes a while to develop its trust.  With my Honda, there was no question of it not starting or causing any trouble.  Just put in the key and off you go mile after mile.  

As you said - splash, yes that can do it.    
« Last Edit: August 23, 2010, 01:47:51 AM by singhg5 »
1970's Jawa /  Yezdi
2006 Honda Nighthawk
2009 Royal Enfield Black G5

singhg5

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2010, 01:54:32 AM »
--
« Last Edit: August 23, 2010, 03:25:07 AM by singhg5 »
1970's Jawa /  Yezdi
2006 Honda Nighthawk
2009 Royal Enfield Black G5

jjoe256

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2010, 02:01:52 AM »
Without an oil circulation diagram, I would guess that the oil would either go from the filter to the pump or to the engine with a passive return and the breather is off the top of the tranny where there is just splash. If the hole was plugged, the engine should shut from lack of pressure in either case.

singhg5

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2010, 02:11:03 AM »
The oil in the sump is screened through oil strainer at the bottom, then pumped up into the oil filter chamber for filtration.  This filtered oil is circulated in 3 ways. One branch goes down to flywheel.  Second branch takes oil up to hydaulic tappet.  The third branch goes up to rocker assembly and then it drains down through push rod tunnel. 
1970's Jawa /  Yezdi
2006 Honda Nighthawk
2009 Royal Enfield Black G5

jjoe256

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2010, 02:59:59 AM »
Thanx for that. What about shut offs, sensors,etc. It would seem the engine would seize or get nasty, but it ran great, started easily, etc. I could reset the oil filter but even if it were askew, it would still let oil pass. Resetting the filter isn't a big deal, might try it. But I still don't see how that would force oil up the breather, if it forcing it up, there would be more oil, especially when running, I would think.

singhg5

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2010, 03:23:57 AM »
Jjoe256:

Actually the breather tube is at the top on crank case as you have said earlier.  Sorry for confusion.  But the oil circulation description is correct - as per manual.  No need to open or reset oil filter.  Since your engine ran fine it is most likely a splash or if motorcycle tips to side or something along those lines.  

Sensors do not detect oil pressure.  They detect electronic malfunction or circuits such as - throttle position sensor, manifold air pressure sensor, crank position sensor, temperature sensor or circuit, ignition coil circuit, fuel injector circuit., rollover sensor circuit.

« Last Edit: August 23, 2010, 03:32:39 AM by singhg5 »
1970's Jawa /  Yezdi
2006 Honda Nighthawk
2009 Royal Enfield Black G5

jjoe256

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Re: G-5 Oil change Enigma
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2010, 07:54:41 PM »
Singhg, if you send me an email I'll send you pix of an easy fix ScooterBob sent me to make the filter easier to change.